User:InProgress/Website reviews/G - Revision history

Redirect fixer: Automatically fixing double redirect from Criticism of Mormonism/Websites/MormonThink/The Greek Psalter Translation to Criticism of Mormonism/Websites/MormonThink/The Greek Psalter Incident in a maintenance job.

2017-04-01T11:14:15Z

Automatically fixing double redirect from Criticism of Mormonism/Websites/MormonThink/The Greek Psalter Translation to Criticism of Mormonism/Websites/MormonThink/The Greek Psalter Incident in a maintenance job.

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	#REDIRECT [[Criticism of Mormonism/Websites/MormonThink/The Greek Psalter ~~Translation~~]]		#REDIRECT [[Criticism of Mormonism/Websites/MormonThink/The Greek Psalter Incident]]

RogerNicholson: redirect

2012-05-05T20:25:31Z

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RogerNicholson: /* */ mod

2012-05-05T20:24:08Z

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	* This action speaks to whether Joseph was a prophet and whether he was capable of translation.		* This action speaks to whether Joseph was a prophet and whether he was capable of translation.
	* No "church" sources or websites discuss this matter, but despite this claim cites the Church-sponsored Maxwell Institute and Hugh Nibley.		* No "church" sources or websites discuss this matter, but despite this claim cites the Church-sponsored Maxwell Institute and Hugh Nibley.
	*MormonThink states that this "wasn't really a translation," but concludes that because of "Book of Abraham, Kinderhook Plates and the Joseph Smith translation of the Bible," that the Greek Psalter story "further damages Joseph's claims to be a true seer." Therefore, it isn't really a problem, but because of other things it is really a problem.		*MormonThink states that this "wasn't really a translation," but concludes that because of the "Book of Abraham, Kinderhook Plates and the Joseph Smith translation of the Bible," that the Greek Psalter story "further damages Joseph's claims to be a true seer." Therefore, it isn't really a problem, but because of other things it is really a problem.

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2012-05-05T20:23:43Z

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	* Joseph reportedly made a false identification about the language and contents of a Greek Psalter (book of psalms written in Greek).		* Joseph reportedly made a false identification about the language and contents of a Greek Psalter (book of psalms written in Greek).
	* This action speaks to whether Joseph was a prophet and whether he was capable of translation.		* This action speaks to whether Joseph was a prophet and whether he was capable of translation.
	* No "church" sources or websites discuss this matter.		* No "church" sources or websites discuss this matter, but despite this claim cites the Church-sponsored Maxwell Institute and Hugh Nibley.
			*MormonThink states that this "wasn't really a translation," but concludes that because of "Book of Abraham, Kinderhook Plates and the Joseph Smith translation of the Bible," that the Greek Psalter story "further damages Joseph's claims to be a true seer." Therefore, it isn't really a problem, but because of other things it is really a problem.

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2012-05-05T20:12:23Z

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	{{Website response summary\|date=1 May 2012}}		{{Website response summary\|date=1 May 2012}}

	The ~~positions that this MormonThink article appears to take are the following:~~
			{{MormonThinkSummaryHeader\|The Greek Psalter Translation}}
	* Joseph reportedly made a false identification about the language and contents of a Greek Psalter (book of psalms written in Greek).		* Joseph reportedly made a false identification about the language and contents of a Greek Psalter (book of psalms written in Greek).
	* This action speaks to whether Joseph was a prophet and whether he was capable of translation.		* This action speaks to whether Joseph was a prophet and whether he was capable of translation.

GregSmith: /* */

2012-05-05T19:41:17Z

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	\|quote=		\|quote=
	* And, finally, Joseph had studied Greek--he would have known Greek when he saw it:		* And, finally, Joseph had studied Greek--he would have known Greek when he saw it:
			** On 20 November 1835, Oliver Cowdery returned from New York and brought Joseph a Hebrew and Greek lexicon.{{ref\|jsp.135}}
	* On 20 November 1835, Oliver Cowdery returned from New York and brought Joseph a Hebrew and Greek lexicon.{{ref\|jsp.135}}		** On 23 December 1835, Joseph wrote that he was "at home studying the greek Language..."{{ref\|foster1}}
	* On 23 December 1835, Joseph wrote that he was "at home studying the greek Language..."{{ref\|foster1}}
	\|link=Joseph Smith/Translator/Greek psalter		\|link=Joseph Smith/Translator/Greek psalter
	\|subject=Joseph Smith and the Greek psalter		\|subject=Joseph Smith and the Greek psalter

RogerNicholson: rm

2012-05-03T04:23:51Z

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 * Notice the effort to sneak in a ''huge'' area of discussion on the [[Book_of_Mormon|Book of Mormon]] and [[Book_of_Abraham|Book of Abraham]]&mdash;we won't handle those here, though there are lots of resources on these issues.
 * The Greek Psalter episode does, however, reveal a "disturbing pattern" with MormonThink, and perhaps their character.  They ignore data that does not fit their theory, and generally don't even mention it. They act as if things are proved when they have not proved them.  And, they repeat the same charges over and over again.
 |quote=
 }}

GregSmith: /* */

2012-05-01T20:37:12Z

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	\|claim=We regret that we could not find this issue discussed in any church publication or web site. However we found several responses from LDS apologists and LDS leaders which we cite below. Per the Neal A. Maxwell Institute...		\|claim=We regret that we could not find this issue discussed in any church publication or web site. However we found several responses from LDS apologists and LDS leaders which we cite below. Per the Neal A. Maxwell Institute...
	\|think=		\|think=
	*The Neal A. Maxwell institute ''is'' sponsored by the Church.		*The Neal A. Maxwell institute ''is'' sponsored by the Church. And MormonThink mentions Nibley's paper, so why this false claim when they know better?
	*The following works published by Church presses all deal with the issue. MormonThink does not know the data well, or chooses to ignore it, since they do not ~~include~~ the most important criticisms against Caswall's account.		*The following works published by Church presses all deal with the issue. MormonThink does not know the data well, or chooses to ignore it, since they do not discuss the most important criticisms against Caswall's account.
	**{{BYUS\|author= Craig L. Foster\|article=[https://byustudies.byu.edu/showTitle.aspx?title=6344 Henry Caswall: Anti-Mormon Extraordinaire]\|date=1995-96\|vol=35\|num=4\|start=144\|end=159}}		**{{BYUS\|author= Craig L. Foster\|article=[https://byustudies.byu.edu/showTitle.aspx?title=6344 Henry Caswall: Anti-Mormon Extraordinaire]\|date=1995-96\|vol=35\|num=4\|start=144\|end=159}}
	**{{Book:Widtose:Joseph Smith Seeker After Truth\|pages=91ff}}		**{{Book:Widtose:Joseph Smith Seeker After Truth\|pages=91ff}}

GregSmith: /* {{Endnotes link}} */

2012-05-01T20:33:01Z

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	}}		}}

	=={{Endnotes ~~link~~}}==		=={{Endnotes label}}==
	#{{note\|jsp.135}} {{JSP1\|start=135}}		#{{note\|jsp.135}} {{JSP1\|start=135}}
	#{{note\|foster1}} {{BYUS\|author= Craig L. Foster\|article=[https://byustudies.byu.edu/showTitle.aspx?title=6344 Henry Caswall: Anti-Mormon Extraordinaire]\|date=1995-96\|vol=35\|num=4\|start=144\|end=?}}		#{{note\|foster1}} {{BYUS\|author= Craig L. Foster\|article=[https://byustudies.byu.edu/showTitle.aspx?title=6344 Henry Caswall: Anti-Mormon Extraordinaire]\|date=1995-96\|vol=35\|num=4\|start=144\|end=?}}

GregSmith: /* */

2012-05-01T20:32:18Z

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	\|think=		\|think=
	* MormonThink is again assuming that Caswell's account is accurate.		* MormonThink is again assuming that Caswell's account is accurate.
	* We repeat: if Joseph ''truly said this'', then why didn't Caswell give him the book or sell him the book so Joseph could do what Caswell claimed Joseph wanted to do?		* We repeat: if Joseph ''truly said this'', then why didn't Caswell give him the book or sell him the book so Joseph could do publicly and in print what Caswell claimed Joseph wanted to do?
	* The story doesn't hang together. Think about it.		* The story doesn't hang together. Think about it.
	\|quote=		\|quote=