Journal of Discourses/24/5 - Revision history

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	\|T=Journal of Discourses 24: THE CHURCH BASED UPON THE PRINCIPLE OF PERFECT FREEDOM—WHEN A PRESIDENT RESIGNS, HIS COUNSELORS GO OUT OF OFFICE—HIGH PRIESTS TO PRESIDE—PRESIDENTS CHOOSE THEIR OWN COUNSELORS—ALL AUTHORITIES SUSTAINED BY VOTE OF THE SAINTS—POSITION OF PRESIDENTS CANNON AND SMITH IF PRESIDENT TAYLOR SHOULD RESIGN—SAINTS NOT TO INTERFERE WITH THE RELIGION OF OTHERS		\|T=Journal of Discourses 24: THE CHURCH BASED UPON THE PRINCIPLE OF PERFECT FREEDOM—WHEN A PRESIDENT RESIGNS, HIS COUNSELORS GO OUT OF OFFICE—HIGH PRIESTS TO PRESIDE—PRESIDENTS CHOOSE THEIR OWN COUNSELORS—ALL AUTHORITIES SUSTAINED BY VOTE OF THE SAINTS—POSITION OF PRESIDENTS CANNON AND SMITH IF PRESIDENT TAYLOR SHOULD RESIGN—SAINTS NOT TO INTERFERE WITH THE RELIGION OF OTHERS
	\|A=~~CHECK~~		\|A=John Taylor
	\|<=[[../4\|Exhortation From Isaiah, etc.]]		\|<=[[../4\|Exhortation From Isaiah, etc.]]
	\|>=[[../6\|Hostile Feeling Towards the Saints, etc.]]		\|>=[[../6\|Hostile Feeling Towards the Saints, etc.]]
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	\|S=REMARKS BY PRESIDENT JOHN TAYLOR, Delivered at Ogden, Sunday, January 21st, 1883. (REPORTED BY GEO. F. GIBBS.)		\|S=REMARKS BY PRESIDENT JOHN TAYLOR, Delivered at Ogden, Sunday, January 21st, 1883. (REPORTED BY GEO. F. GIBBS.)
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	\|A~~= John Taylor~~
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	\| section=[[../\|Volume 24]], THE CHURCH BASED UPON THE PRINCIPLE OF PERFECT FREEDOM—WHEN A PRESIDENT RESIGNS, HIS COUNSELORS GO OUT OF OFFICE—HIGH PRIESTS TO PRESIDE—PRESIDENTS CHOOSE THEIR OWN COUNSELORS—ALL AUTHORITIES SUSTAINED BY VOTE OF THE SAINTS—POSITION OF PRESIDENTS CANNON AND SMITH IF PRESIDENT TAYLOR SHOULD RESIGN—SAINTS NOT TO INTERFERE WITH THE RELIGION OF OTHERS		\|previous=[[../4\|Exhortation From Isaiah, etc.]]
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	\| notes=~~REMARKS BY PRESIDENT JOHN TAYLOR, Delivered at Ogden, Sunday, January 21st, 1883. (REPORTED BY GEO. F. GIBBS.)~~
	~~(Online document scan [http://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/cdm4/document.php?CISOROOT=/JournalOfDiscourses3&CISOPTR=9617&REC=17 ''Journal of Discourses'', Volume 24])~~
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	We talk a great deal about the religious liberty that is guaranteed unto us in this land of the free, home of the brave and asylum for the oppressed; yet men are contriving all the time to deprive us of the rights of conscience, and of religious liberty. And what of it? Would we treat them as they treat us? No, no, no; a thousand times no. Why not? Says Jesus, "The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also." On the same occasion He said to His disciples, after commanding them to love one another, "If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. If ye were of the world, the world would love its own; but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." There was then, and there is to-day, and there always has been, a spirit of antagonism between the powers of light and the powers of darkness. There has been a conflict in the world ever since the creation of man to the present time. And that spirit of antagonism to the truth that existed in former ages exists in this age, and we have reason to know it. Is it because we are wicked that we are opposed? We are not as good as we might be by a great deal, it is true; we ought to be better than a great many people, and we are; and our lives and conduct prove it, notwithstanding there are a great many evils among us that we ought to repent of and put away. Yet, do we injure anybody? I do not know that we do. Do we wish to deprive anybody of his rights? Not that I know of. We are accused a good deal of this and everything else, in fact. Do we wish to interfere with anybody's religion? I hope you do not do it here. You have Methodists and Presbyterians and Catholics, as well as other different sects; would you want to interfere with them? I do not think for a moment, that you would. We may think that their ideas are foolish in many respects, but then they have a perfect right to entertain them, and there are none, I think, that recognize that right sooner than we as Latter-day Saints. We believe in freedom of conscience; we believe that all men should be guaranteed the right to worship God according to the dictates of their conscience. Some may want to worship a God {{page break\|37\|top}} without body, parts or passions; a God that sits on the top of a topless throne; although to me the idea of worshiping such a God would be most ridiculous, if other people desire to do it, all right, and they should be protected in that right. But while we accord to all men the right to think, and the right to worship as they please, we claim the same right for ourselves. And then we do not want to have a set of men placed over us in a governmental capacity who do not recognize the rights of humanity; men who want to control the human mind. We want to maintain correct principles; and we want to sustain all men that do maintain them. We have a right to do that. Some, however, think that we have not that right even; and they are frequently trying to introduce principles that are at variance with our constitutional rights. But it is our duty to maintain our rights; it is our duty to stand up for those principles which guarantee freedom to man, and we intend to do it, God being our helper; and not permit the wicked and ungodly, the corrupt and depraved to deprive us of our rights. But I shall be talking about politics if I keep on much longer; what I have said, however, is correct, and it affects us as American citizens. We possess just as many rights as any other American citizens; and if there is anything contrary to this, it is contrary to the genius of the institutions of our country. We are all free and equal, at least, we are supposed to be; but we are not. We may as well laugh as cry about these things though, as it makes but little difference. We are engaged in doing the work of God; and we are seeking to do the will of God; and He has established a Church, which we, in the name of Israel's God, will help to sustain. And we should not be concerned about the consequences of our acts. The Lord has all men in His keeping, and He has us in His keeping; and we cannot do anything only as He permits us. How could you Elders, who have been out preaching and baptizing, and confirming members into the Church, have imparted to them the gift of the Holy Ghost through the laying on of hands, excepting God were with you. And if God were not with Israel to-day, Israel could not be sustained. But God is on the side of Israel; and He will sustain His people if they will observe His laws and keep His commandments. And no man can successfully fight against Jehovah, for He will say to any that oppose Zion, as He did to the waves of the mighty ocean, "Hitherto shalt thou come and no further, and here shalt thy proud waves be stayed." We are in the hands of God; and the nation is also in the hands of God; and we can do nothing unless He permits us; neither can this or any other nation. He controls them according to the counsel of his own will; and He manipulates, manages and directs the affairs of the children of men. He has appointed us to do a work. It is not our work; but we are willing to do it with His help. Will He be thwarted in His designs? I tell you, No. The kingdom of God will roll forth, and no man can stay it. And woe to that man who lifts up his hand against it; for the Lord is managing this work, not us, and it is His business to take care of His Saints. Therefore, we feel easy, comfortable, joyous and happy. And I feel all the day long like singing hallelujah, hallelujah, hallelujah, the Lord God Omnipotent reigneth; and He will reign until all His enemies are put under His {{page break\|38\|top}} feet. And Zion will progress and triumph, and the work of God will go forth, and the kingdom of God will be established, and the Zion of God built up, and all things spoken of by the holy Prophets will be fulfilled; and the kingdom of God will progress until the kingdoms of this world become the kingdom of our God and His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever, and unrighteousness and wickedness, corruption and evil will be trampled under His feet. God bless you, and lead you in the paths of life, in the name of Jesus. Amen.		We talk a great deal about the religious liberty that is guaranteed unto us in this land of the free, home of the brave and asylum for the oppressed; yet men are contriving all the time to deprive us of the rights of conscience, and of religious liberty. And what of it? Would we treat them as they treat us? No, no, no; a thousand times no. Why not? Says Jesus, "The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also." On the same occasion He said to His disciples, after commanding them to love one another, "If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. If ye were of the world, the world would love its own; but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." There was then, and there is to-day, and there always has been, a spirit of antagonism between the powers of light and the powers of darkness. There has been a conflict in the world ever since the creation of man to the present time. And that spirit of antagonism to the truth that existed in former ages exists in this age, and we have reason to know it. Is it because we are wicked that we are opposed? We are not as good as we might be by a great deal, it is true; we ought to be better than a great many people, and we are; and our lives and conduct prove it, notwithstanding there are a great many evils among us that we ought to repent of and put away. Yet, do we injure anybody? I do not know that we do. Do we wish to deprive anybody of his rights? Not that I know of. We are accused a good deal of this and everything else, in fact. Do we wish to interfere with anybody's religion? I hope you do not do it here. You have Methodists and Presbyterians and Catholics, as well as other different sects; would you want to interfere with them? I do not think for a moment, that you would. We may think that their ideas are foolish in many respects, but then they have a perfect right to entertain them, and there are none, I think, that recognize that right sooner than we as Latter-day Saints. We believe in freedom of conscience; we believe that all men should be guaranteed the right to worship God according to the dictates of their conscience. Some may want to worship a God {{page break\|37\|top}} without body, parts or passions; a God that sits on the top of a topless throne; although to me the idea of worshiping such a God would be most ridiculous, if other people desire to do it, all right, and they should be protected in that right. But while we accord to all men the right to think, and the right to worship as they please, we claim the same right for ourselves. And then we do not want to have a set of men placed over us in a governmental capacity who do not recognize the rights of humanity; men who want to control the human mind. We want to maintain correct principles; and we want to sustain all men that do maintain them. We have a right to do that. Some, however, think that we have not that right even; and they are frequently trying to introduce principles that are at variance with our constitutional rights. But it is our duty to maintain our rights; it is our duty to stand up for those principles which guarantee freedom to man, and we intend to do it, God being our helper; and not permit the wicked and ungodly, the corrupt and depraved to deprive us of our rights. But I shall be talking about politics if I keep on much longer; what I have said, however, is correct, and it affects us as American citizens. We possess just as many rights as any other American citizens; and if there is anything contrary to this, it is contrary to the genius of the institutions of our country. We are all free and equal, at least, we are supposed to be; but we are not. We may as well laugh as cry about these things though, as it makes but little difference. We are engaged in doing the work of God; and we are seeking to do the will of God; and He has established a Church, which we, in the name of Israel's God, will help to sustain. And we should not be concerned about the consequences of our acts. The Lord has all men in His keeping, and He has us in His keeping; and we cannot do anything only as He permits us. How could you Elders, who have been out preaching and baptizing, and confirming members into the Church, have imparted to them the gift of the Holy Ghost through the laying on of hands, excepting God were with you. And if God were not with Israel to-day, Israel could not be sustained. But God is on the side of Israel; and He will sustain His people if they will observe His laws and keep His commandments. And no man can successfully fight against Jehovah, for He will say to any that oppose Zion, as He did to the waves of the mighty ocean, "Hitherto shalt thou come and no further, and here shalt thy proud waves be stayed." We are in the hands of God; and the nation is also in the hands of God; and we can do nothing unless He permits us; neither can this or any other nation. He controls them according to the counsel of his own will; and He manipulates, manages and directs the affairs of the children of men. He has appointed us to do a work. It is not our work; but we are willing to do it with His help. Will He be thwarted in His designs? I tell you, No. The kingdom of God will roll forth, and no man can stay it. And woe to that man who lifts up his hand against it; for the Lord is managing this work, not us, and it is His business to take care of His Saints. Therefore, we feel easy, comfortable, joyous and happy. And I feel all the day long like singing hallelujah, hallelujah, hallelujah, the Lord God Omnipotent reigneth; and He will reign until all His enemies are put under His {{page break\|38\|top}} feet. And Zion will progress and triumph, and the work of God will go forth, and the kingdom of God will be established, and the Zion of God built up, and all things spoken of by the holy Prophets will be fulfilled; and the kingdom of God will progress until the kingdoms of this world become the kingdom of our God and His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever, and unrighteousness and wickedness, corruption and evil will be trampled under His feet. God bless you, and lead you in the paths of life, in the name of Jesus. Amen.

	~~[[fr:Journal of Discourses/24/5]]~~

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	We talk a great deal about the religious liberty that is guaranteed unto us in this land of the free, home of the brave and asylum for the oppressed; yet men are contriving all the time to deprive us of the rights of conscience, and of religious liberty. And what of it? Would we treat them as they treat us? No, no, no; a thousand times no. Why not? Says Jesus, "The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also." On the same occasion He said to His disciples, after commanding them to love one another, "If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. If ye were of the world, the world would love its own; but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." There was then, and there is to-day, and there always has been, a spirit of antagonism between the powers of light and the powers of darkness. There has been a conflict in the world ever since the creation of man to the present time. And that spirit of antagonism to the truth that existed in former ages exists in this age, and we have reason to know it. Is it because we are wicked that we are opposed? We are not as good as we might be by a great deal, it is true; we ought to be better than a great many people, and we are; and our lives and conduct prove it, notwithstanding there are a great many evils among us that we ought to repent of and put away. Yet, do we injure anybody? I do not know that we do. Do we wish to deprive anybody of his rights? Not that I know of. We are accused a good deal of this and everything else, in fact. Do we wish to interfere with anybody's religion? I hope you do not do it here. You have Methodists and Presbyterians and Catholics, as well as other different sects; would you want to interfere with them? I do not think for a moment, that you would. We may think that their ideas are foolish in many respects, but then they have a perfect right to entertain them, and there are none, I think, that recognize that right sooner than we as Latter-day Saints. We believe in freedom of conscience; we believe that all men should be guaranteed the right to worship God according to the dictates of their conscience. Some may want to worship a God {{page break\|37\|top}} without body, parts or passions; a God that sits on the top of a topless throne; although to me the idea of worshiping such a God would be most ridiculous, if other people desire to do it, all right, and they should be protected in that right. But while we accord to all men the right to think, and the right to worship as they please, we claim the same right for ourselves. And then we do not want to have a set of men placed over us in a governmental capacity who do not recognize the rights of humanity; men who want to control the human mind. We want to maintain correct principles; and we want to sustain all men that do maintain them. We have a right to do that. Some, however, think that we have not that right even; and they are frequently trying to introduce principles that are at variance with our constitutional rights. But it is our duty to maintain our rights; it is our duty to stand up for those principles which guarantee freedom to man, and we intend to do it, God being our helper; and not permit the wicked and ungodly, the corrupt and depraved to deprive us of our rights. But I shall be talking about politics if I keep on much longer; what I have said, however, is correct, and it affects us as American citizens. We possess just as many rights as any other American citizens; and if there is anything contrary to this, it is contrary to the genius of the institutions of our country. We are all free and equal, at least, we are supposed to be; but we are not. We may as well laugh as cry about these things though, as it makes but little difference. We are engaged in doing the work of God; and we are seeking to do the will of God; and He has established a Church, which we, in the name of Israel's God, will help to sustain. And we should not be concerned about the consequences of our acts. The Lord has all men in His keeping, and He has us in His keeping; and we cannot do anything only as He permits us. How could you Elders, who have been out preaching and baptizing, and confirming members into the Church, have imparted to them the gift of the Holy Ghost through the laying on of hands, excepting God were with you. And if God were not with Israel to-day, Israel could not be sustained. But God is on the side of Israel; and He will sustain His people if they will observe His laws and keep His commandments. And no man can successfully fight against Jehovah, for He will say to any that oppose Zion, as He did to the waves of the mighty ocean, "Hitherto shalt thou come and no further, and here shalt thy proud waves be stayed." We are in the hands of God; and the nation is also in the hands of God; and we can do nothing unless He permits us; neither can this or any other nation. He controls them according to the counsel of his own will; and He manipulates, manages and directs the affairs of the children of men. He has appointed us to do a work. It is not our work; but we are willing to do it with His help. Will He be thwarted in His designs? I tell you, No. The kingdom of God will roll forth, and no man can stay it. And woe to that man who lifts up his hand against it; for the Lord is managing this work, not us, and it is His business to take care of His Saints. Therefore, we feel easy, comfortable, joyous and happy. And I feel all the day long like singing hallelujah, hallelujah, hallelujah, the Lord God Omnipotent reigneth; and He will reign until all His enemies are put under His {{page break\|38\|top}} feet. And Zion will progress and triumph, and the work of God will go forth, and the kingdom of God will be established, and the Zion of God built up, and all things spoken of by the holy Prophets will be fulfilled; and the kingdom of God will progress until the kingdoms of this world become the kingdom of our God and His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever, and unrighteousness and wickedness, corruption and evil will be trampled under His feet. God bless you, and lead you in the paths of life, in the name of Jesus. Amen.		We talk a great deal about the religious liberty that is guaranteed unto us in this land of the free, home of the brave and asylum for the oppressed; yet men are contriving all the time to deprive us of the rights of conscience, and of religious liberty. And what of it? Would we treat them as they treat us? No, no, no; a thousand times no. Why not? Says Jesus, "The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also." On the same occasion He said to His disciples, after commanding them to love one another, "If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you. If ye were of the world, the world would love its own; but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." There was then, and there is to-day, and there always has been, a spirit of antagonism between the powers of light and the powers of darkness. There has been a conflict in the world ever since the creation of man to the present time. And that spirit of antagonism to the truth that existed in former ages exists in this age, and we have reason to know it. Is it because we are wicked that we are opposed? We are not as good as we might be by a great deal, it is true; we ought to be better than a great many people, and we are; and our lives and conduct prove it, notwithstanding there are a great many evils among us that we ought to repent of and put away. Yet, do we injure anybody? I do not know that we do. Do we wish to deprive anybody of his rights? Not that I know of. We are accused a good deal of this and everything else, in fact. Do we wish to interfere with anybody's religion? I hope you do not do it here. You have Methodists and Presbyterians and Catholics, as well as other different sects; would you want to interfere with them? I do not think for a moment, that you would. We may think that their ideas are foolish in many respects, but then they have a perfect right to entertain them, and there are none, I think, that recognize that right sooner than we as Latter-day Saints. We believe in freedom of conscience; we believe that all men should be guaranteed the right to worship God according to the dictates of their conscience. Some may want to worship a God {{page break\|37\|top}} without body, parts or passions; a God that sits on the top of a topless throne; although to me the idea of worshiping such a God would be most ridiculous, if other people desire to do it, all right, and they should be protected in that right. But while we accord to all men the right to think, and the right to worship as they please, we claim the same right for ourselves. And then we do not want to have a set of men placed over us in a governmental capacity who do not recognize the rights of humanity; men who want to control the human mind. We want to maintain correct principles; and we want to sustain all men that do maintain them. We have a right to do that. Some, however, think that we have not that right even; and they are frequently trying to introduce principles that are at variance with our constitutional rights. But it is our duty to maintain our rights; it is our duty to stand up for those principles which guarantee freedom to man, and we intend to do it, God being our helper; and not permit the wicked and ungodly, the corrupt and depraved to deprive us of our rights. But I shall be talking about politics if I keep on much longer; what I have said, however, is correct, and it affects us as American citizens. We possess just as many rights as any other American citizens; and if there is anything contrary to this, it is contrary to the genius of the institutions of our country. We are all free and equal, at least, we are supposed to be; but we are not. We may as well laugh as cry about these things though, as it makes but little difference. We are engaged in doing the work of God; and we are seeking to do the will of God; and He has established a Church, which we, in the name of Israel's God, will help to sustain. And we should not be concerned about the consequences of our acts. The Lord has all men in His keeping, and He has us in His keeping; and we cannot do anything only as He permits us. How could you Elders, who have been out preaching and baptizing, and confirming members into the Church, have imparted to them the gift of the Holy Ghost through the laying on of hands, excepting God were with you. And if God were not with Israel to-day, Israel could not be sustained. But God is on the side of Israel; and He will sustain His people if they will observe His laws and keep His commandments. And no man can successfully fight against Jehovah, for He will say to any that oppose Zion, as He did to the waves of the mighty ocean, "Hitherto shalt thou come and no further, and here shalt thy proud waves be stayed." We are in the hands of God; and the nation is also in the hands of God; and we can do nothing unless He permits us; neither can this or any other nation. He controls them according to the counsel of his own will; and He manipulates, manages and directs the affairs of the children of men. He has appointed us to do a work. It is not our work; but we are willing to do it with His help. Will He be thwarted in His designs? I tell you, No. The kingdom of God will roll forth, and no man can stay it. And woe to that man who lifts up his hand against it; for the Lord is managing this work, not us, and it is His business to take care of His Saints. Therefore, we feel easy, comfortable, joyous and happy. And I feel all the day long like singing hallelujah, hallelujah, hallelujah, the Lord God Omnipotent reigneth; and He will reign until all His enemies are put under His {{page break\|38\|top}} feet. And Zion will progress and triumph, and the work of God will go forth, and the kingdom of God will be established, and the Zion of God built up, and all things spoken of by the holy Prophets will be fulfilled; and the kingdom of God will progress until the kingdoms of this world become the kingdom of our God and His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever, and unrighteousness and wickedness, corruption and evil will be trampled under His feet. God bless you, and lead you in the paths of life, in the name of Jesus. Amen.

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	{{~~header~~		{{header2
	\| title = [[../../]]		\| title = [[../../]]
	\| author = John Taylor ~~(Latter Day Saints)~~		\| author = John Taylor
	\| translator =		\| translator =
	\| section=[[../\|Volume 24]], THE CHURCH BASED UPON THE PRINCIPLE OF PERFECT FREEDOM—WHEN A PRESIDENT RESIGNS, HIS COUNSELORS GO OUT OF OFFICE—HIGH PRIESTS TO PRESIDE—PRESIDENTS CHOOSE THEIR OWN COUNSELORS—ALL AUTHORITIES SUSTAINED BY VOTE OF THE SAINTS—POSITION OF PRESIDENTS CANNON AND SMITH IF PRESIDENT TAYLOR SHOULD RESIGN—SAINTS NOT TO INTERFERE WITH THE RELIGION OF OTHERS		\| section=[[../\|Volume 24]], THE CHURCH BASED UPON THE PRINCIPLE OF PERFECT FREEDOM—WHEN A PRESIDENT RESIGNS, HIS COUNSELORS GO OUT OF OFFICE—HIGH PRIESTS TO PRESIDE—PRESIDENTS CHOOSE THEIR OWN COUNSELORS—ALL AUTHORITIES SUSTAINED BY VOTE OF THE SAINTS—POSITION OF PRESIDENTS CANNON AND SMITH IF PRESIDENT TAYLOR SHOULD RESIGN—SAINTS NOT TO INTERFERE WITH THE RELIGION OF OTHERS