FAIR - User contributions [en]

Joseph Smith/Seer stones

2007-03-26T02:23:48Z

MikeClark: /* What happened to the seer stone? */

{{JosephSmithPortal}}
{{question}}
==Question==
What can you tell me about Joseph's seer stone? What is its relation to the "Urim and Thummim"?
==Response==

===How did Joseph obtain his seer stone?===

The seer stone was reportedly found on the property of William Chase in 1822 as Chase described it:

:In the year 1822, I was engaged in digging a well. I employed Alvin and Joseph Smith to assist me.... After digging about twenty feet below the surface of the earth, we discovered a singularly appearing stone, which excited my curiosity. I brought it to the top of the well, and as we were examining it, Joseph put it into his hat, and then his face into the top of his hat.... The next morning he came to me, and wished to obtain the stone, alleging that he could see in it; but I told him I did not wish to part with it on account of its being a curiosity, but I would lend it.{{ref|chase1}}

Martin Harris and Wilford Woodruff were to later confirm this account after Joseph's death.{{ref|confirmchase}}

===What did the stone look like?===
One witness reported, from 1826:

:It was about the size of a small hen's egg, in the shape of a high-instepped shoe. It was composed of layers of different colors passing diagonally through it. It was very hard and smooth, perhaps by being carried in the pocket.{{ref|stonesize}}

===For what purpose(s) did Joseph use the stone prior to the restoration?===

Martin Harris recounted that Joseph could find lost objects with the stone:

:: I was at the house of his father in Manchester, two miles south of Palmyra village, and was picking my teeth with a pin while sitting on the bars. The pin caught in my teeth and dropped from my fingers into shavings and straw. I jumped from the bars and looked for it. Joseph and Northrop Sweet also did the same. We could not find it. I then took Joseph on surprise, and said to him--I said, "Take your stone." I had never seen it, and did not know that he had it with him. He had it in his pocket. He took it and placed it in his hat--the old white hat--and placed his face in his hat. I watched him closely to see that he did not look to one side; he reached out his hand beyond me on the right, and moved a little stick and there I saw the pin, which he picked up and gave to me. I know he did not look out of the hat until after he had picked up the pin.{{ref|pin}}

Joseph's mother also indicated that Joseph was sought out by some, including Josiah Stoal, to use the stone to find hidden valuables. He

:came for Joseph on account of having heard that he possessed certain keys by which he could discern things invisible to the natural eye.{{ref|lucymack1}}

Joseph referred to this incident in {{scripture||JS-H|1|55-56}}.

Stoal eventually joined the Church; some of his family, however, charged Joseph in court for events related to this treasure seeking. Stoal testified in Joseph's defense. (See ''FAIRwiki'' article on the trial [[Joseph_Smith's_1826_glasslooking_trial|here]].)

===How was the stone involved in the translation of the Book of Mormon?===

Joseph Knight recalled that Joseph was more excited about the Nephite interpreters than the gold plates:

:After breakfast Joseph called me into the other room, set his foot on the bed, and leaned his head on his hand and said, "Well I am disappointed."
:"Well, I said, "I am sorry."
:"Well, he said, "I am greatly disappointed. It is ten times better than I expected."
:Then he went on to tell the length and width and thickness of the plates and, said he, they appear to be gold. But, he seemed to think more of the glasses or the Urim and thummim than he did of the plate for, said he, "I can see anything. They are marvelous."{{ref|knight1}}

Martin Harris later described the Nephite interpreters as

:about two inches in diameter, perfectly round, and about five-eighths of an inch thick at the centre.... They were joined by a round bar of diver, about three-eights of an inch in diameter, and about four inches long, which with the two stones, would make eight inches.{{ref|harris1}}

Despite having the Nephite interpreters, Joseph Smith often used the seer stone to translate. This led to an episode in which Martin tested the veracity of Joseph's claim to use the stone to translate:

:Once Martin found a rock closely resembling the seerstone Joseph sometimes used in place of the interpreters and substituted it without the Prophet’s knowledge. When the translation resumed, Joseph paused for a long time and then exclaimed, “Martin, what is the matter, all is as dark as Egypt.” Martin then confessed that he wished to “stop the mouths of fools” who told him that the Prophet memorized sentences and merely repeated them.{{ref|mouthoffools}}

Following the loss of the 116 pages, the Lord told Joseph:

:1 NOW, behold, I say unto you, that because you delivered up those writings which you had power given unto you to translate by the means of the Urim and Thummim, into the hands of a wicked man, you have lost them.
:2 And you also lost your gift at the same time, and your mind became darkened.
:3 Nevertheless, it is now restored unto you again; therefore see that you are faithful and continue on unto the finishing of the remainder of the work of translation as you have begun.
:4 Do not run faster or labor more than you have strength and means provided to enable you to translate; but be diligent unto the end.{{s||DC|10|1-4}}

Thus, "it" (Joseph's gift) was restored to him, but there is no indication that the Nephite interpreters (Urim and Thummim) were also returned, Joseph having also lost "them." In fact, the historical record suggests the opposite:

:As a chastisement for this carelessness [loss of the 116 pages], the Urim and Thummim was taken from Smith. But by humbling himself, he again found favor with the Lord and was presented a strange oval-shaped, chocolate colored stone, about the size of an egg, but more flat which it was promised should answer the same purpose. With this stone all the present book was translated.{{ref|hr1}}

David Whitmer, who only came in contact with the translation after the loss of the 116 pages, indicated through a friend that

:With the sanction of David Whitmer, and by his authority, I now state that he does not say that Joseph Smith ever translated in his presence by aid of Urim and Thummim; but by means of one dark colored, opaque stone, called a 'Seer Stone,' which was placed in the crown of a hat, into which Joseph put his face, so as to exclude the external light. Then, a spiritual light would shine forth, and parchment would appear before Joseph, upon which was a line of characters from the plates, and under it, the translation in English; at least, so Joseph said.{{ref|sh1}}

Joseph also used the seer stone to keep himself and the plates safe, as his mother recorded:

:That of which I spoke, which Joseph termed a key, was indeed, nothing more nor less than the Urim and Thummim, and it was by this that the angel showed him many things which he saw in vision; by which also he could ascertain, at any time, the approach of danger, either to himself or the Record, and on account of which he always kept the Urim and Thummim about his person.{{ref|lucymack2}}

We see here the tendency to use the term "Urim and Thummim" to refer to Joseph's seer stone (or to the Nephite interpreters, which would have been too large for Joseph to carry on his person undetected). This lack of precision in terminology has, on occasion, confused some members who have not understood that either or both may be referred to by authors as "Urim and Thummim."

===What is the relation between Urim and Thummim and seer stones?===

As seen above, members of the Church tended to conflate the seer stone with the Nephite interpreters (never called "Urim and Thummim" by the Book of Mormon text; the label is a modern application).

The Book of Mormon makes reference to a stone that likely has reference to Joseph Smith's seer stone (as distinct from the Nephite interpreters):

: And the Lord said: I will prepare unto my servant Gazelem, a stone, which shall shine forth in darkness unto light, that I may discover unto my people who serve me, that I may discover unto them the works of their brethren, yea, their secret works, their works of darkness, and their wickedness and abominations.{{s||Alma|37|23}}

Joseph Smith's "code name," used for the publication of some sections of the Doctrine and Covenants to hide the recipients from their enemies, was "Gazalem." And, at his funeral, W.W. Phelps also applied this name to Joseph.{{ref|gazalem1}}

Alma's account then goes on to speak of the Nephite interpreters:

:24 And now, my son, these interpreters were prepared that the word of God might be fulfilled, which he spake, saying:
:25 I will bring forth out of darkness unto light all their secret works and their abominations; and except they repent I will destroy them from off the face of the earth; and I will bring to light all their secrets and abominations, unto every nation that shall hereafter possess the land.{{s||Alma|37|24-25}}

Thus, "stone" (singular) may well be distinct from the "interpreters" (plural) possessed by the Nephites. The Book of Mosiah makes clear that the interpreters consisted of "two stones":

: 13 Now Ammon said unto him: I can assuredly tell thee, O king, of a man that can translate the records; for he has wherewith that he can look, and translate all records that are of ancient date; and it is a gift from God. And the things are called interpreters, and no man can look in them except he be commanded, lest he should look for that he ought not and he should perish. And whosoever is commanded to look in them, the same is called seer.
:14 And behold, the king of the people who are in the land of Zarahemla is the man that is commanded to do these things, and who has this high gift from God.{{s||Mosiah|8|3-14}}
:…
:13 And now he translated them by the means of those two stones which were fastened into the two rims of a bow.
:14 Now these things were prepared from the beginning, and were handed down from generation to generation, for the purpose of interpreting languages;
:15 And they have been kept and preserved by the hand of the Lord, that he should discover to every creature who should possess the land the iniquities and abominations of his people;
:16 And whosoever has these things is called seer, after the manner of old times. .{{s||Mosiah|28|13-16}}

The first use in print of "Urim and Thummim" to refer to the interpreters was in January 1833:

:[The Book of Mormon] was translated by the gift and power of God, by an unlearned man, through the aid of a pair of Interpreters, or spectacles--(known, perhaps in ancient days as Teraphim, or Urim and Thummim).{{ref|wwphelps1}}

Members of the Church seem to have used the term interchangeably on many occasions.{{ref|interchange1}}

===Why did Joseph tend to use the seer stone more than the Nephite interpreters?===

The size of the interpreters may have been a significant barrier to their use. William Smith, Joseph's brother, described the Nephite instruments as

:too large for Joseph's eyes; they must have been used by larger men.{{ref|williamsmith1}}

Charles Anthon agreed when he later recalled Martin Harris' description and wrote:

:These spectacles were so large that if a person attempted to look through them, his two eyes would have to be turned towards one of the glasses merely, the spectacles in question being altogether too large for the breadth of the human face.{{ref|anthon1}}

===Why did use of the seer stone subside?===

The Urim and Thummim were the means of receiving most of the formal revelations until June 1829. That was the time of completing the Book of Mormon, which was translated through the Urim and Thummim and also the seer stone. But no type of stone is involved in receiving revelation or translation after that. Orson Pratt watched the New Testament revision and wondered why the Book of Mormon procedure was not continued:

::While this thought passed through the speaker's mind, Joseph, as if he read his thoughts, looked up and explained that the Lord gave him the Urim and Thummim when he was inexperienced in the Spirit of inspiration. But now he had advanced so far that he understood the operations of that Spirit and did not need the assistance of that instrument.{{ref|prattuandt}}

===Are there any Biblical parallels to Joseph's seer stone understanding?===

The idea of sacred stones acting as revelators to believers is present in the Bible, and Joseph Smith embraced a decidedly "non-magical" and "pro-religious" view of them:

:In Revelation, John incorporates past religious symbols into his message. Thus the most internally consistent interpretation of the "white stone" combines with the book's assurance that the faithful will become "kings and priests" to the Most High (Rev. 1:6). These eternal priests will be in tune with God's will, like the High Priest with the breastplate of shining stones and the Urim. In Hebrew that term means "light," corresponding to the "white" stone of John's Revelation. This correlation should be obvious, but Joseph Smith is virtually alone in confidence that John sees the redeemed as full High Priests: "Then the white stone mentioned in Rev. 2:17 is the Urim and Thummim, whereby all things pertaining to a higher order of kingdoms, even all kingdoms, will be made know." As for genuine religion, Joseph Smith perceived the stone of John's vision not as a stone of chance but as a conduit of enlightenment and a reward of worthiness of character.{{ref|revelationjohn1}}

===What happened to the seer stone?===

Van Wagoner and Walker write:
: David Whitmer indicated that the seer stone was later given to Oliver Cowdery: "After the translation of the Book of Mormon was finished early in the spring of 1830 before April 6th, Joseph gave the Stone to Oliver Cowdery and told me as well as the rest that he was through with it, and he did not use the Stone anymore.” Whitmer, who was Cowdery's brother-in-law, stated that on Oliver's death in 1848, another brother-in-law, "Phineas Young, a brother of Brigham Young, and an old-time and once intimate friend of the Cowdery family came out from Salt Lake City, and during his visit he contrived to get the stone from its hiding place, through a little deceptive sophistry, extended upon the grief-stricken widow. When he returned to Utah he carried it in triumph to the apostles of Brigham Young's 'lion house.'"

: Whatever the exact circumstances of its acquisition, the Chase seer stone remained in Brigham Young's possession until his death in 1877. Hosea Stout described in detail the stone President Young displayed to the University of Deseret Board of Regents on 25 February 1856, "a silecious granite dark color almost black with light colored stripes some what resembling petrified poplar or cotton wood bark. It was about the size but not the shape of a hen's egg."

: This same seer stone was carried by President Wilford Woodruff to the dedication of the Manti Temple in 1888: "Before leaving I consecrated upon the Altar the sears stone that Joseph Smith found by Revelation some 30 feet under the earth carried by him through life." Another description of the stone was given by Richard M. Robinson when he returned from a Southern States mission in 1899 and presented a strange coin he felt might be of Nephite origin to President Lorenzo Snow. Robinson relates that President Snow

::went and got the money purse or leather bag that President Young had brought to the Rocky Mountains with him, also the Seer Stone and said, "This is the Seer Stone that the Prophet Joseph used. There are very few worthy to view this, but you are." He handed the Seer Stone to me and I couldn't express the joy that came to me and took that stone in my hands. Words are not equal to the task of expressing such a sublime joy! He then told me to hand the Seer Stone to my wife and I handed it to her. He then blessed us with the greatest blessing I have ever heard fall from the mouth of man!

::The Seer Stone was the shape of an egg though not quite so large, of a gray cast something like granite but with white stripes running around it. It was transparent but had no holes, neither in the end or in the sides. I looked into the stone, but could see nothing, as I had not the gift and power of God that must accompany such a manifestation.

:Though we seldom hear the Chase seer stone mentioned in the Church today, it remains in the possession of the First Presidency. Joseph Fielding Smith, as an apostle, made clear that "the Seer Stone which was in the possession of the Prophet Joseph Smith in early days . . . is now in the possession of the Church." Elder Joseph Anderson, Assistant to the Council of the Twelve and long-time secretary to the First Presidency, clarified in 1971 that the "Seer Stone that Joseph Smith used in the early days of the Church is in possession of the Church and is kept in a safe in Joseph Fielding Smith's office.... [The stone is] slightly smaller than a chicken egg, oval, chocolate in color."{{ref|fatestone}}

==Endnotes==

#{{note|chase1}} Eber Dudley Howe, ''Mormonism Unvailed'' (Painesville, Ohio: Telegraph Press, 1834), 241-242; cited in {{Dialogue|author=Richard Van Wagoner and Steven Walker|article=Joseph Smith: 'The Gift of Seeing|vol=15|num=2|date=Summer 1982|start=48|end=68}}
#{{note|chaseconfirm}} See Van Wagoner and Walker, 54.

#{{note|stonesize}} W. D. Purple, ''The Chenango Union'' (3 May 1877); cited in {{NewWitnessForChrist1|vol=2|start=365}} (See Van Wagoner and Walker, 54.)

#{{note|refpin}} Joel Tiffany, ''Tiffany's Monthly'' (June 1859): 164;cited in Van Wagoner and Walker, 55.
#{{note|lucymack1}} {{biosketch|start=91|end=92}}

#{{note|knight1}} Joseph Knight, cited in Leonard J. Arrington and Davis Bitton, ''Saints Without Halos: The Human Side of Mormon History'' (Salt Lake City, Signature Books, 1981), 6. Spelling and punctuation have been modernized. The original text reads: "After Brackfist Joseph Cald me in to the other Room and he sit his foot on the Bed and leaned his head on his hand and says, well I am Dissopented. Well, say I, I am sorrey. Well, says he, I am grateley Dissopnted. It is ten times Better then I expected. Then he went on to tell the length and width and thickness of the plates and, said he, they appear to be gold. But he seamed to think more of the glasses or the urim and thummim than he Did of the plates for says he, I can see anything. They are Marvelous."
#{{note|harris1}} Joel Tiffany, ''Tiffany's Monthly'' (June 1859): 165–166; cited in VanWagoner and Walker, footnote 27.
#{{note|mouthoffools}} Told in ''Millennial Star'' 44:87; quotation from {{Ensign1|author=Kenneth W. Godfrey|article=A New Prophet and a New Scripture: The Coming Forth of the Book of Mormon|date=January 1988|start=6}}{{link|url=http://library.lds.org/nxt/gateway.dll/Magazines/Ensign/1988.htm/ensign%20january%201988.htm/a%20new%20prophet%20and%20a%20new%20scripture%20the%20coming%20forth%20of%20the%20book%20of%20mormon.htm}}
#{{note|hr1}} ''The Historical Record. Devoted Exclusively to Historical, Biographical, Chronological and Statistical Matters'', (LDS Church Archives), 632,; cited in Van Wagoner and Walker, 54.
#{{note|sh1}} ''Saints' Herald'' 26 (15 November 1879): 341.
#{{note|lucymack2}} {{Biosketch1|start=106}} Also cited in {{LucyMackSmith-Nibley1|start=107}}; {{IE1|author=Joel Ricks|article=Urim and Thummim|date=May 1915|vol=18|num=7|start=?}}

#{{note|gazalem1}} The material on "gazelem" is derived from Van Wagoner and Walker, 56.
#{{ref|wwphelps1}} {{EMS1|vol=1|num=8|date=January 1833|author=William W. Phelps (uncredited)|article=The Book of Mormon|start=58}}; cited in Van Wagoner and Walker, 53. {{link|url=http://www.centerplace.org/history/ems/v1n08.htm Direct}}
#{{note|interchange1}} See discussion in Van Wagoner and Walker, 59–63.

# {{note|williamsmith1}} William Smith interview by J. W. Peterson and W. S. Pender, 4 July 1891, reported in ''The Rod of Iron'' 3 (February 1924): 6-7; ''Saints' Herald'' 79 (9 March 1932): 238; cited in VanWagoner and Walker, footnote 27.
#{{note|anthon1}} Charles Anthon letter to E. D. Howe, 17 Feb. 1834, published in E.D. Howe, ''Mormonism Unvailed'', 17; cited in VanWagoner and Walker, footnote 27.

#{{note|prattuandt}} {{MatureJS}} ; citing Orson Pratt, "Discourse at Brigham City," 27 June 1874, Ogden (Utah) Junction, cited in {{MS|author=Orson Pratt|article=Two Days´ Meeting at Brigham City|vol=36|date=11 August 1874|start=498|end=499}}

#{{note|revelationjohn1}} {{MatureJS}}

#{{note|fatestone}} Van Wagoner and Walker, 58–59 (citations removed).


===FAIR wiki articles===
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===FAIR web site===
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===External links===
*{{Dialogue|author=Richard Van Wagoner and Steven Walker|article=Joseph Smith: 'The Gift of Seeing|vol=15|num=2|date=Summer 1982|start=49|end=68}} {{link|url=http://content.lib.utah.edu/cdm4/document.php?CISOROOT=/dialogue&CISOPTR=16574&REC=16}}{{NB}}
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===Printed material===
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The Kirtland Egyptian Papers

2007-03-25T18:51:24Z

MikeClark: /* Answer */ Fixed tag that blew the table away

{{BofAPortal}}{{question}}

==Question==

What are the Kirtland Egyptian Papers and how do they relate to the Book of Abraham? Some critics of the Book of Abraham have claimed that these papers are evidence that Joseph Smith made up the Book of Abraham; on what grounds do they make that claim, and how strong is it?

===Source(s) of criticism===
*Edward H. Ashment, "Reducing Dissonance: The Book of Abraham as a Case Study." In ''The Word of God: Essays on Mormon Scripture,'' edited by Dan Vogel (Salt Lake City: Signature, 1990), 221–35.
*Brent Lee Metcalfe, "Nibley's Illusory Variants," ''mormonscripturestudies.com.''

==Answer==

The Kirtland Egyptian Papers (KEP) are a collection of documents written by various individuals, mostly dating to the Kirtland period of Church history (early- to mid-1830s), constituting some sort of study documents relating to the [[Book of Abraham papyri|Joseph Smith Egyptian Papyri]].

The KEP comprise 16 documents encompassing a total of about 120 pages. They are typically divided into two categories:
*so-called Egyptian alphabet and grammar documents (KEPE), and
*Book of Abraham manuscript documents (KEPA).

The following table{{ref|table1}} gives a basic description of the KEP:

<table width="100%">
<tr style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #cccccc; text-align: left">
<th>Number</th>
<th>Date</th>
<th>Size</th>
<th>Handwriting</th>
<th>Title and Contents</th>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPE 1</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1836 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1 volume, 31x20 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">W.W. Phelps & Warren Parrish</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">"Grammar & aphabet [sic] of the Egyptian language"</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPE 2</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1836 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">2 leaves, 33x20 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">W.W. Phelps</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">"Egyptian counting"</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPE 3</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1 October 1835 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">4 leaves, 32x20 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">W.W. Phelps</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">"Egyptian alphabet"</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPE 4</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1 October 1835 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">9 leaves, 32x20 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Joseph Smith & Oliver Cowdery</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">"Egyptian alphabet"</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPE 5</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1 October 1835 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">4 leaves, various sizes</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Oliver Cowdery</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">[title lost, "Egyptian alphabet" (?)]</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPE 6</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">26 Nov. 1835 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1 volume, 20x13 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Oliver Cowdery</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">"Valuable discovery of hiden [sic] records"</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPE 7</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1837 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1 volume, 20x16 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Oliver Cowdery</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">"F.G.W." and "William"</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPE 8</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">26 Nov. 1835 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1 leaf, 32x40 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">?</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">[no title]</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPE 9</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">26 Nov. 1835 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1 leaf, 39x19 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">?</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">[no title]</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPE 10</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Mounted Feb. 1836 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1 leaf, 33x20 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">—</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">[no title] = Joseph Smith Papyrus (JSP) IX</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPA 1</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1836 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">10 leaves, 32x20 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">W.W. Phelps & Warren Parrish</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">[no title] [http://scriptures.lds.org/abr/1 Abraham 1:1]–2:18</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPA 2</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1836 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">4 leaves, 33x19 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Frederick G. Williams{{ref|fgw1}}</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">[no title] Abraham 1:4–2:6</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPA 3</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1836 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">6 leaves, 32x19 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Warren Parrish</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">[no title] Abraham 1:4–2:2</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPA 4</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Feb. 1842 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">18 leaves, 29x20 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Willard Richards</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">[no title] Abraham 1:1–3:26</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPA 5</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">March 1842 (?)</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">4 leaves, various sizes</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Willard Richards</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">[no title] [http://scriptures.lds.org/abr/fac_2 Facsimile 2]</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">KEPA 6</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">1842</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">Broadside 32x19 cm</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">—</td>
<td style="border-bottom: solid thin">[back has a letter to Clyde Williams & Co., signed by Joseph Smith and W.W. Phelps]</td>
</tr>
</table>

The most extensive of these documents is KEPE 1, which is an intact bound book, containing 34 nonconsecutive pages of writing and 186 blank pages (an average of three written pages being followed by 18 to 20 blank pages).

===Provenance===

An inventory of Church records to be taken west from Nauvoo, prepared by Thomas Bullock in 1846, included an entry for "Egyptian Grammar in Jennetta's Trunk." This document presumably was KEPE 1. The Jennetta spoken of was the late wife of Willard Richards, the Prophet Joseph's secretary. The ''Journal History of the Church'' under the date 17 October 1855 lists the "Egyptian Alphabet" in an inventory of items moved into a new fire proof vault. This again appears to be KEPE 1. An 1847 inventory of Church property delivered to Newel K. Whitney for transport included "A small Parchment roll of Hieroglyphics," which may have included some of the loose KEP. It is also possible that some of the other, smaller documents were brought separately to the Great Basin by W.W. Phelps.

Although these documents were brought west from Nauvoo and deposited in the Church Historian's office, they were unused and eventually knowledge of them was lost. The Egyptian Grammar was eventually rediscovered in that office by Sidney Sperry in 1935.

KEPA 1 has a separate provenance. This document was given by Emma Smith to her second husband, Lewis Bidamon, who gave it to his son, Charles Bidamon, from whom the great collector of Mormon artifacts, Wilford Wood, obtained it. Wood presented this document to the Church in 1937.

The various provenances of these documents raise the possibility that the collection we have today may not be complete, with some of the documents having been lost.

===Publication history===

The KEP have never been formally published. Jerald and Sandra Tanner obtained a microfilm copy of most of them and informally published them as ''Joseph Smith's Egyptian Alphabet & Grammar''.{{ref|tanner1}} An improved informal compilation was prepared by H. Michael Marquardt under the title ''The Joseph Smith Egyptian Papers'' in 1981. This informal edition is still available from Marquardt's website. Both of these editions are photocopies made from microfilm.

The late Steven F. Christensen, before he was murdered by [[Mark Hofmann]], commissioned the photographing of the KEP at the LDS Church archives. From those negatives, at least four sets of color prints were made, including copies now in the possession of George D. Smith, Edward Ashment and Brent Metcalfe. Metcalfe has indicated that he intends to formally publish the KEP, with high quality color photographs on the left side of the page and an improved transcription on the right side of the page.

It is also possible that the Maxwell Institute at BYU will do its own critical edition of the KEP as part of its ''Studies in the Book of Abraham'' series, although no formal announcement of such a publication has been made.

===Approaches to the KEP===

The attitude of critics to the KEP is straightforward. They claim that:
#the KEP represent the translation working papers for the Book of Abraham;
#the KEPE demonstrate that Joseph did not understand Egyptian;
#the KEPA demonstrate that the Sensen Papyrus was believed to be the source for the Book of Abraham; and
#since the Sensen Papyrus is in fact not the Book of Abraham but an Egyptian Book of Breathings, whatever else the Book of Abraham may be, it is not an accurate translation of an ancient Egyptian text.

LDS approaches to the KEP have been more varied. The first significant scholarly study of the matter, by John A. Tvedtnes and Richley Crapo, appeared in a series of articles under the auspices of the Society for Early Historic Archaeology from 1968 to 1970. Their theory was that the Sensen Papyrus may have represented a mnemonic device to bring to mind a longer oral tradition — a tradition that corresponded to the narrative of the Book of Abraham as we know it. This theory was grounded in two observations. First, the hieratic symbols copied into the left margin of the KEPA documents were complete morphemes, as opposed to the inappropriate breaks one would expect of someone who could not read Egyptian. Second, in every case the meaning of the hieratic word in the margin shows up in some relevant way in the much longer English text corresponding to the hieratic word. Of course, lots of other words and concepts are present as well, but the meaning of the hieratic word in each case is present in the English text.

While a fascinating study, the Tvedtnes and Crapo mnemonic device theory never really caught on. Hugh Nibley was intrigued by this possibility at first, but then decided to go in a different direction. Nibley authored a seminal, lengthy study of the KEP in ''BYU Studies'' entitled "The Meaning of the Kirtland Egyptian Papers." He did not attempt to defend the KEP as revelatory documents (other than the English portions of the KEPA). Rather, he took the view that the KEP represent either a preliminary "studying it out" stage in the process, or a (failed) attempt to reverse engineer the English translation so as to decipher the Egyptian language. In other words, the English text of the Book of Abraham was received by revelation as opposed to a purely mechanical process. While Joseph was involved in the KEP project, a theme of Nibley's piece is to portray the efforts of Phelps, Cowdery, and Parrish as largely independent of Joseph. Nibley's take has become the dominant LDS view, and has been echoed more recently in several publications by John Gee.

A small minority of LDS commenters on the KEP seeks to defend the supposed revelatory character of these documents, viewing them through the lenses of kabbalism or extreme symbolism. This point of view is characterized by Joe Sampson and Paul Osborne. It has few adherents.

===Directions for further research===

The KEP have been understudied to date. Although preliminary studies have appeared from various perspectives, much more work needs to be done. In many ways, apologetic or polemical approaches to these documents are premature. Rather, they first must be studied rigorously from a scholarly perspective.

An essential tool that is a prerequisite to further progress is a critical edition of the texts. While the microfilm photocopy editions are sufficient for limited purposes and to get a feel for the documents, they are totally inadequate for serious scholarly study. Ideally such scholarship should be grounded in a study of the original documents. To the extent that they are not available for such study, the color photographs that are in existence would be the next best basis for such an edition.

In addition to a careful and clear presentation of the texts, such a study needs to focus on understanding the documents. Too much energy has been devoted to attack and defense, and not enough to basic comprehension of what those involved in the project thought they were doing and how they went about their work. Such a study needs to bring the same standards and attention to detail to these texts as Royal Skousen has brought to his study of the original text of the Book of Mormon.

Some of the contested issues for which such a study could bring enlightenment include the following:

'''Involvement of Joseph Smith.''' That Joseph was involved to some degree in the project is clear. His handwriting appears on two of the documents, and there are references to the project in his journals. The extent of his involvement is a hotly contested issue and needs to be clarified. Nibley tried hard to distance Joseph from the work of the scribes. Edward Ashment has questioned Nibley's position. The extent to which Joseph dominated the process, or the scribes acted independently, or they all acted in a collaborative manner, needs to be clarified.

'''Meaning of technical teminology like "degree" and "part."''' The terms "degree" and "part" seem to be used in the KEPE as some sort of grammatical terms of art. If so, their meaning needs to be divined. Conversely, John Tvedtnes has argued that they are not grammatical terms at all, but refer to locations on the papyri where particular symbols were located; a sort of latitude and longitude system. According to this view, for example, the "first part" is what we call [http://scriptures.lds.org/abr/fac_1 Facsimile 1], and the "first degree" of that part is the first column of the facsimile, while the second degree is the second column. The second part is what Nibley called the Small Sensen Papyrus (JSP XI), and the first degree of the second part is the first of its columns, counting from the right (away from Facsimile 1). Tvedtnes' explanation of the usage of these terms needs to be evaluated; in particular, as to whether his proposed system in fact holds for all uses of the terms.

'''Sequencing issues.''' Although the handwriting of the various scribes on the various texts has been identified, there are numerous sequencing issues that need to be explored. Is there a way to determine in what sequence the documents were created? Were the KEPA documents created at the same time from dictation, or were they visually copied from a single source, and if so, which is the source document? Which was written first on the page, the hieratic symbols in the left margin of the KEPA documents or the English text to the right? Were the hieratic symbols visually copied from the Sensen Papyrus, and if so, can we determine who copied them?

'''Why does the scope of the English text not match the scope of the hieratic symbols in the margins of the KEPA?''' There is a substantial and obvious disproportion between the hieratic symbols in the left margins of the KEPA and the accompanying English text to the right. Critics often trot this fact out as an obvious artifact of Joseph's ignorance. But this begs the question why such a disproportion exists. The disproportion is so marked that surely even Joseph must have been aware of it, and even if he were not, the scribes involved in the project had training in other languages, such that they would have noted and objected to the disproportion. It is not enough merely to observe the disproportion, it must be explained. What did these men think they were doing? Does the juxtaposition of a hieratic symbol and an entire paragraph of English text intend to reflect a translation process, or is some other process at work, and if so, what?

==Conclusion==

When the [[Book of Abraham papyri|Joseph Smith Papyri]] were recovered and the connection to the KEP first noted, Richard Howard, then historian for the Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (now the Community of Christ), was quoted in the ''New York Times'' as saying that we now knew the ''modus operandi'' by which the translation of the Book of Abraham was created.{{ref|nytimes1}} But this statement was premature. We do not know the ''modus operandi'' at all. If we were to give the complete KEPE, the Joseph Smith Papyri, and the sequence of hieratic symbols in the left margins of the KEPA to someone and then ask that person to recreate the Book of Abraham from those materials, he could not do it. The KEPE reflect a half-dozen phrases from the Book of Abraham, isolated and without context. But the Book of Abraham is a coherent and readily understood English text, while the KEPE is a mishmash of linguistic gobbledigook. It is completely unclear how one could possibly get the one from the other.

So what is the source of the English Book of Abraham? It would appear that the English text is a revelation to the Prophet Joseph Smith, whatever he thought he was doing in the KEP project. There is ample precedent for the Prophet receiving such coherent revelations before that did not require him to wrestle with deciphering the ancient language of the source text. For example, [[Book of Mormon translation method|Joseph translated the Book of Mormon almost entirely without reference to the gold plates themselves]], and [http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/7 Doctrine and Covenants 7] is a revealed translation of ancient parchment that was never physically given to Joseph.

The coherent words of the Book of Abraham did not really come from an analysis of the Egyptian materials before Joseph or his scribes; rather, they were uttered by the Prophet and recorded by his scribes in much the same way that all of his revelatory translation projects were done. To the critic, this simply means that Joseph made up the coherent text and dictated it; to the believer, it means that Joseph received the text by revelation and dictated it. The difference between these two points of view is a matter of faith, and not something that any amount of wrangling with the KEP can resolve definitively one way or the other.

==Endnotes==
#{{note|table1}}John Gee, "Eyewitness, Hearsay, and Physical Evidence of the Joseph Smith Papyri," p. 196.
#{{note|fgw1}}Until recently this was believed to be W.W. Phelps' handwriting.
#{{note|tanner1}}''Joseph Smith's Egyptian Alphabet & Grammar,'' Salt Lake City: Modern Microfilm Company, 1966.
#{{note|nytimes1}}''New York Times,'' 2 May 1970.

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
{{BookofAbrahamWiki}}

===FAIR web site===
{{BookofAbrahamFAIR}}

===External links===

{{BookofAbrahamLinks}}

===Printed material===
{{BookofAbrahamPrint}}

Creation out of nothing (creatio ex nihilo)

2007-03-25T18:35:32Z

MikeClark: /* The New Testament */

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==Criticism==
Mainstream Christianity teaches that God created the universe from nothing (''ex nihilo''), while Mormons teach that God organized the universe from pre-existing matter. The LDS God is therefore claimed to be "less powerful" than the God of mainstream Christianity, or "unBiblical."

===Source(s) of the Criticism===
*Paul Copan and William Lane Craig. "Craftsman or Creator? An Examination of the Mormon Doctrine of Creation and a Defense of Creatio ex nihilo," in ''The New Mormon Challenge: Responding to the Latest Defenses of a Fast-Growing Movement'', ed. Francis J. Beckwith, Carl Mosser, and Paul Owen, (Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 2002), 95–152.
* Paul Copan and William Lane Craig, ''Creation out of Nothing: A Biblical, Philosophical, and Scientific Exploration'', (Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Books, 2004).

==Response==

===The problem of a pre-existent 'something'===
The reason why most of modern Christianity demands ex-nihilo creation stems from arguments dealing with the sovereignty of God. If something exists apart from God - i.e. pre-exists the first act of creation, it must be co-eternal with God (and by extension, perhaps co-equal, or potentially co-equal). Likewise, LDS scripture teaches that there exists something which is co-eternal with God and potentially co-equal with God in the Book of Abraham. Is God absolutely transcendant over the material with which he works? Is there only one that pre-exists creation (God) or is there more than one?

===The Old Testament===
The Old Testament makes no direct statement of ex-nihilo creation, and so the creation account is scrutinized for clues. Much of the debate over ex-nihilo creation stems from the first few verses of Genesis. And the controversy starts with the very first word: ''bereshit''. The interpretation of Genesis 1:1 faces two questions. 1) Is Genesis 1:1 an independant sentence or a dependant clause, introducing the first sentence? And 2) What is the relationship of verse 1 to verse 2 (and even the remainder of the creation narrative in Genesis chapter 1)?

The Hebrew word ''roshit'' occurs some 50 times in the Old Testament. The vowels in the word indicate that is a construct form - that it means "beginning of" and not just "beginning". Of the other 50 occurences, 49 of them follow this pattern. The exact same construction with the prefix ''be-'' occurs in four other places (Jer. 26:1; 27:1; 28:1; 49:34), and in each instance is generally translated as "In the beginning of the reign of ..." The other instances of ''roshit'' follow this construct pattern except for one in Isaiah 46:10, where we read: "I am God ... declaring the end from the beginning." Here there can be little doubt that the word cannot be read as a construct. And this one occurence is often used to justify reading ''bereshit'' in Genesis 1:1 as an absolute and not a construct. To which we respond, is a grammatical error in one location reason to justify an adoption of a similar reading here? Why should we adopt the reading favored by one example over the dozens of alternatives?

If ''beroshit'' is a construct state, then verse 1 and verse 2 are both subordinate clauses describing the state of everything at the moment which God begins to create, and the beginning of verse 3 becomes the main clause for the first sentence of the Bible. Read this way, the beginning of the Bible reads:

:When God began to create the heavens and the earth (the earth being without form and void, and darkness was on the surface of the deep, and the spirit of God moved upon the surface of the waters), God said, "Let there be light".

The first act of creation then is the command for light to exist. And all the rest - the earth as a desert and a wasteland (terms that imply an absence of both plant and animal life), the darkness, the deep, and so on, all exist prior to that first act of creation - and by definition are pre-existent.

Apart from this passage, there is often discussion over the meaning of the word ''bara'' - "to create". The Hebrew term ''bara'' itself is rather indifferent to the question of ex-nihilo creation. Often the claim is made that the word is used exclusively of God, but this clearly isn't the case (see for example Ezekiel 21:19). The meaning of ''bara'' here is dependant entirely on how we read the rest of the first line of the Old Testament.

In the absence of any Old Testament expressions of ex-nihilo creation, it seems preferrable to follow the view that Israelite religion had not developed this theology. Joseph Smith resolved the interpretive crux in Genesis 1:1 in a rather unique fashion. In the Book of Moses, rather than defining creation in absolute terms (either from nothing or from something), he limits the description of creation in Genesis to a particular place and time. Creation is no longer universal:

:And it came to pass, that the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, 'Behold, I reveal unto you concerning this heaven and this earth; write the words which I speak. ... Yea, in the beginning I created the heaven and the earth upon which thou standest. ({{s||Moses|2|1,3}})

===The New Testament===
The New Testament doesn't provide much additional help in resolving the issue. It relies heavily on the language of the Old Testament when discussing creation. And the same sorts of ambiguities arise. As James Hubler's Ph.D. dissertation on this very issue noted:

:Several New Testament texts have been educed as evidence of ''creatio ex nihilo''. None makes a clear statement which would have been required to establish such an unprecedented position, or which we would need as evidence of such a break with tradition. None is decisive and each could easily be accepted by a proponent of ''creatio ex materia''...The punctuation of [John 1:3] becomes critical to its meaning. Proponents of ''creatio ex materia'' could easily qualify the creatures of the Word to that "which came about," excluding matter. Proponents of creatio ex nihilo could place a period after "not one thing came about" and leave "which came about" to the next sentence. The absence of a determinate tradition of punctuation in New Testament [Greek] texts leaves room for both interpretations. Neither does creation by word imply ''ex nihilo''...as we have seen in Egypt, Philo, and Midrash Rabba, and even in 2 Peter 3:5, where the word functions to organize pre-cosmic matter. {{ref|hubler1}}

===Early Christian beliefs about creation===
Contrary to the critics' claims, their belief in ''ex nihilo'' creation was not shared by the first Christians. The concept of ''creatio ex nihilo''

:began to be adumbrated in Christian circles shortly before Galen's time. The first Christian thinker to articulate the rudiments of a doctrine of creatio ''ex nihilo'' was the Gnostic theologian Basilides, who flourished in the second quarter of the second century. Basilides worked out an elaborate cosmogony as he sought to think through the implications of Christian teaching in light of the platonic cosmogony. He rejected the analogy of the human maker, the craftsman who carves a piece of wood, as an anthropomorphism that severely limited the power of God. God, unlike mortals, created the world out of ‘non-existing’ matter. He first brought matter into being through the creation of ‘seeds’, and it is this created stuff that is fashioned, according to His will, into the cosmos.{{ref|name1}}

Thus, the doctrine of ''creatio ex nihilo'' was first advanced by a Gnostic (a heretical branch of Christianity), and did not appear until more than a century after the birth of Christ.

The idea of God using pre-existing material in creation was accepted by at least some of the early Church Fathers, suggesting that beliefs about the mechanism of creation altered over time, as Greek philosophical ideas intruded on Christian doctrine. Justin Martyr (A.D. 110—165) said:

:And we have been taught that He in the beginning did of His goodness, for man's sake, create all things out of unformed matter; and if men by their works show themselves worthy of this His design, they are deemed worthy, and so we have received-of reigning in company with Him, being delivered from corruption and suffering.” {{ref|name2}}

Justin continues elsewhere with such examples as:

* “by the word of God the whole world was made out of the substance spoken of before by Moses.”{{ref|name3}}
* [the earth,] “which God made according to the pre-existent form.” {{ref|name4}}
* “And His Son, who alone is properly called Son, the Word who also was with Him and was begotten before the works, when at first He created and arranged all things by Him, is called Christ, in reference to His being anointed and God's ordering all thing; through Him...”{{ref|name5}}

Justin was not the only Father to reject ''ex nihilo'' creation. Clement said in his "Hymn to the Paedagogus":

: Out of a confused heap who didst create This ordered sphere, and from the shapeless mass Of matter didst the universe adorn . . . .{{ref|name6}}

And, Blake Ostler comments on ''1 Clement'':

:Clement stated: "Thou . . . didst make manifest the everlasting fabric of the world. Thou, Lord, didst create the earth." The terms used here by Clement are significant. He asserts that God did "make manifest" (ἐϕανεροποίησας) the "everlasting fabric of the world" (Σὺ τὴν ἀέναον του κόσμου σύστασιν). He is referring to an eternal substrate that underlies God's creative activity. Clement is important because he is at the very center of the Christian church as it was then developing. His view assumed that God had created from an eternally existing substrate, creating by "making manifest" what already existed in some form. The lack of argumentation or further elucidation indicates that Clement was not attempting to establish a philosophical position; he was merely maintaining a generally accepted one. However, the fact that such a view was assumed is even more significant than if Clement had argued for it. If he had presented an argument for this view, then we could assume that it was either a contested doctrine or a new view. But because he acknowledged it as obvious, it appears to have been a generally accepted belief in the early Christian church.{{ref|ostler1}}

==The doctrine is altered==

Non-LDS author Edwin Hatch noted the influence of some Greek philosophical ideas in the change to ''creatio ex nihilo'':

:With Basilides [a second century Gnostic philosopher], the conception of matter was raised to a higher plane. The distinction of subject and object was preserved, so that the action of the Transcendent God was still that of creation and not of evolution; but it was "out of that which was not" that He made things to be . . . . The basis of the theory was Platonic, though some of the terms were borrowed from both Aristotle and the Stoics. It became itself the basis for the theory which ultimately prevailed in the Church. The transition appears in Tatian [ca. 170 A.D.]{{ref|hatch1}}

==Conclusion==

One non-LDS scholar's conclusion is apt:

:''Creatio ex nihilo'' appeared suddenly in the latter half of the second century c.e. Not only did ''creatio ex nihilo'' lack precedent, it stood in firm opposition to all the philosophical schools of the Greco-Roman world. As we have seen, the doctrine was not forced upon the Christian community by their revealed tradition, either in Biblical texts or the Early Jewish interpretation of them. As we will also see it was not a position attested in the New Testament doctrine or even sub-apostolic writings. It was a position taken by the apologists of the late second century, Tatian and Theophilus, and developed by various ecclesiastical writers thereafter, by Irenaeus, Tertullian, and Origen. ''Creatio ex nihilo'' represents an innovation in the interpretive traditions of revelation and cannot be explained merely as a continuation of tradition.{{ref|hubler2}}

''Creatio ex nihilo'' is not taught in the Old or New Testaments, or by the early Christian Fathers, unless one assumes it. The doctrine was a novel idea that altered the beliefs and doctrines of the Jews and early Christians.

Critics are welcome to embrace an unBiblical doctrine if they wish; they should not, however, disparage the LDS, who cling to the Biblical view as reinforced and reaffirmed by modern prophets.

==Endnotes==
#{{note|hubler1}} James N. Hubler, "Creatio ex Nihilo: Matter, Creation, and the Body in Classical and Christian Philosophy through Aquinas" (PhD diss., University of Pennsylvania, 1995), 107–8; cited in {{FR-17-2-8}}
# {{note|name1}} Gerhard May, ''Schoepfung Aus Dem Nichts: Die Entstehung Der Lehre Von Der Creatio Ex Nihilo (Arbeiten Zur Kirchengeschichte, Vol 48)'' (Walter De Gruyter Inc, 1978), 63-85. ISBN 3110072041; as quoted in Robert Louis Wilken, ''The Christians as the Romans saw Them'' (Yale University Press, 2003), 88–89. ISBN 0300098391.
# {{note|name2}} {{anf1|vol=1|start=165|citation=Chapter 10|author=Justin Martyr|article=First Apology of Justin}}
# {{note|name3}} {{anf1|vol=1|start=182|citation=Chapter 59|author=Justin Martyr|article=First Apology of Justin}}
# {{note|name4}} {{anf1|vol=1|start=286|citation=Chapter 30|author=Justin Martyr|article=Hortatory to the Greeks}}
# {{note|name5}} {{anf1|vol=1|start=165|citation=Chapter 10|author=Justin Martyr|article=First Apology of Justin}}
# {{note|name6}} {{anf1|vol=2|start=296|citation=?|author=Clement|article=Hymn to the Paedagogus}}
# {{note|ostler1}} {{FR-17-2-8}}; citing ''1 Clement'' 60, in J. B. Lightfoot, ''The Apostolic Fathers'', ed. J. R. Harmer (1891; repr., Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Book, 1956), 1:176. Lightfoot translates this text as: "Thou through Thine operations didst make manifest the everlasting fabric of the world" (1:303). See Oscar de Gebhardt and Adolphus Harnack, ''Patrium Apostolicorum Opera: Clementis Romani'' (Leipzig: Hinrichs, 1876), 1:100.
#{{note|hatch1}} Edwin Hatch, ''The Influence of Greek Ideas and Usages upon the Christian Church'', 195–196.
#{{note|hubler2}} James N. Hubler, "Creatio ex Nihilo: Matter, Creation, and the Body in Classical and Christian Philosophy through Aquinas" (PhD diss., University of Pennsylvania, 1995), 102; cited in {{FR-17-2-8}}



==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
{{GodWiki}}

===FAIR web site===
*{{Tg|url=http://www.fairlds.org/apol/ai184.html|topic=Creatio ex nihilo}}

===External links===
*{{Ensign|author=Donald Q. Cannon, Larry E. Dahl, and John W. Welch|article=The Restoration of Major Doctrines through Joseph Smith: The Godhead, Mankind, and the Creation|vol=19|start=27|end=33|date=January 1989}} {{link|url=http://library.lds.org/nxt/gateway.dll/Magazines/Ensign/1989.htm/ensign%20january%201989.htm/the%20restoration%20of%20major%20doctrines%20through%20joseph%20smith%20the%20godhead%20mankind%20and%20the%20creation.htm}}
*{{BYUS|author=Keith Norman|article=Ex Nihilo: The Development of the Doctrines of God and Creation in Early Christianity|vol=17|num=3|date=1977|start=291|end=318}} {{link|url=http://byustudies.byu.edu/Products/MoreInfoPage/MoreInfo.aspx?Type=7&ProdID=855}}
*{{FR-11-2-3}}
*{{FR-17-2-8}}{{NB}}

===Printed material===
*Bernhard W. Anderson, ''From Creation to New Creation: Old Testament Perspectives'' (Minneapolis: Fortress, 1994), 30.
*Edwin Hatch, ''The Influence of Greek Ideas on Christianity'' (Gloucester: Smith, 1970), 194–198.
*James N. Hubler, "Creatio ex Nihilo: Matter, Creation, and the Body in Classical and Christian Philosophy through Aquinas" (PhD diss., University of Pennsylvania, 1995).
* {{HonorMadsen|author=Stephen D. Ricks|article=Ancient Views of Creation and the Doctrine of ''Creation ex Nihilo''|start=319|end=337}}

The Bible/Basics

2007-03-24T05:13:52Z

MikeClark:

{{BiblePortal}}
==The Holy Bible==

Latter-day Saints consider the Bible to be holy scripture. The 8th Article of Faith states:

:"We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God."

The proviso that the LDS believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly seems to shake some persons' confidence in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as a Bible-believing church. There is no reason that this should be, for it is hardly a matter of dispute that when men translate words from one language to another they can easily err, and have often done so. Simply comparing different English-language versions of the Bible should demonstrate conclusively that some people understand ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek (the source languages of the Old and New Testaments) quite differently in some cases.

But let no one doubt: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints reveres the Bible and uses it extensively in its teaching and practice. The late Elder James E. Talmage, a member of the Quorum of the Twelve, had this to say about the Bible in his classic book about the Articles of Faith:

:''The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints accepts the Holy Bible as the foremost of her standard works, first among the books which have been proclaimed as her written guides in faith and doctrine. In the respect and sanctity with which the Latter-day Saints regard the Bible they are of like profession with Christian denominations in general, but differ from them in the additional acknowledgment of certain other scriptures as authentic and holy, which others are in harmony with the Bible, and serve to support and emphasize its facts and doctrines.''

:''The historical and other data upon which is based the current Christian faith as to the genuineness of the Biblical record are accepted as unreservedly by the Latter-day Saints as by the members of any sect; and in literalness of interpretation this Church probably excels.''

:''Nevertheless, the Church announces a reservation in the case of erroneous translation, which may occur as a result of human incapacity; and even in this measure of caution we are not alone, for Biblical scholars generally admit the presence of errors of the kind -- both of translation and of transcription of the text. The Latter-day Saints believe the original records to be the word of God unto man, and, as far as these records have been translated correctly, the translations are regarded as equally authentic. The English Bible professes to be a translation made through the wisdom of man; in its preparation the most scholarly men have been enlisted, yet not a version has been published in which errors are not admitted. However, an impartial investigator has cause to wonder more at the paucity of errors than that mistakes are to be found at all.''

:''There will be, there can be, no absolutely reliable translation of these or other scriptures unless it be effected through the gift of translation, as one of the endowments of the Holy Ghost. The translator must have the spirit of the prophet if he would render in another tongue the prophet's words; and human wisdom alone leads not to that possession. Let the Bible then be read reverently and with prayerful care, the reader ever seeking the light of the Spirit that he may discern between truth and the errors of men.'' (James E. Talmage, Articles of Faith, Ch.13, p.236 - p.237)

===External Links===

* [http://www.mormon.org/freeoffers/1,17785,3708-1-2,00.html?src=tv Click here] for a free copy of the King James Version (KJV) Holy Bible
* [http://scriptures.lds.org/ot/contents Old Testament] - KJV, with LDS footnotes and cross-references on-line
* [http://scriptures.lds.org/nt/contents New Testament] - KJV, with LDS footnotes and cross-references on-line
* [[Online_textual_sources_and_materials#Scripture_study | FAIRWiki scripture study links]]

The Bible/Basics

2007-03-24T04:48:51Z

MikeClark:

{{BiblePortal}}
==The Holy Bible==

Latter-day Saints consider the Bible to be holy scripture. The 8th Article of Faith states:

:"We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God."

The proviso that the LDS believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly seems to shake some persons' confidence in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as a Bible-believing church. There is no reason that this should be, for it is hardly a matter of dispute that when men translate words from one language to another they can easily err, and have often done so. Simply comparing different English-language versions of the Bible should demonstrate conclusively that some people understand ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek (the source languages of the Old and New Testaments) quite differently in some cases.

But let no one doubt: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints reveres the Bible and uses it extensively in its teaching and practice. The late Elder James E. Talmage, a member of the Quorum of the Twelve, had this to say about the Bible in his classic book about the Articles of Faith:

:''The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints accepts the Holy Bible as the foremost of her standard works, first among the books which have been proclaimed as her written guides in faith and doctrine. In the respect and sanctity with which the Latter-day Saints regard the Bible they are of like profession with Christian denominations in general, but differ from them in the additional acknowledgment of certain other scriptures as authentic and holy, which others are in harmony with the Bible, and serve to support and emphasize its facts and doctrines.''

:''The historical and other data upon which is based the current Christian faith as to the genuineness of the Biblical record are accepted as unreservedly by the Latter-day Saints as by the members of any sect; and in literalness of interpretation this Church probably excels.''

:''Nevertheless, the Church announces a reservation in the case of erroneous translation, which may occur as a result of human incapacity; and even in this measure of caution we are not alone, for Biblical scholars generally admit the presence of errors of the kind -- both of translation and of transcription of the text. The Latter-day Saints believe the original records to be the word of God unto man, and, as far as these records have been translated correctly, the translations are regarded as equally authentic. The English Bible professes to be a translation made through the wisdom of man; in its preparation the most scholarly men have been enlisted, yet not a version has been published in which errors are not admitted. However, an impartial investigator has cause to wonder more at the paucity of errors than that mistakes are to be found at all.''

:''There will be, there can be, no absolutely reliable translation of these or other scriptures unless it be effected through the gift of translation, as one of the endowments of the Holy Ghost. The translator must have the spirit of the prophet if he would render in another tongue the prophet's words; and human wisdom alone leads not to that possession. Let the Bible then be read reverently and with prayerful care, the reader ever seeking the light of the Spirit that he may discern between truth and the errors of men.'' (James E. Talmage, Articles of Faith, Ch.13, p.236 - p.237)

* [http://www.mormon.org/freeoffers/1,17785,3708-1-2,00.html?src=tv Click here] for a free copy of the King James Version (KJV) Holy Bible
* [http://scriptures.lds.org/ot/contents Old Testament] - KJV, with LDS footnotes and cross-references on-line
* [http://scriptures.lds.org/nt/contents New Testament] - KJV, with LDS footnotes and cross-references on-line
* [[Online_textual_sources_and_materials#Scripture_study | FAIRWiki scripture study links]]

The Bible/Basics

2007-03-24T04:04:27Z

MikeClark: /* The Holy Bible */

Paid clergy

2007-03-24T03:43:56Z

MikeClark: /* No professional ministers */

==Criticism==

Critics claim that Mormonism prides itself in having unpaid clergy. They then show that General Authorities do, in fact, receive a stipend while serving the Church. They point this out in an attempt to show the "hypocrisy" of the Church.


==Response==

===A modest stipend===
Some members of the Church are unaware that at least some general authorities do receive a modest living stipend. However, a call to serve as a general authority usually comes later in life, and none of these men has depended upon their Church service for their "career" or "income." And, given the high calibre and accomplishment of those called to full-time service, it is unreasonable to expect that they couldn't make much more money (with less trouble) in some other field of endeavor.

The fact that this stipend exists has not been hidden. As President Hinckley noted in General Conference:

:Merchandising interests are an outgrowth of the cooperative movement which existed among our people in pioneer times. The Church has maintained certain real estate holdings, particularly those contiguous to Temple Square, to help preserve the beauty and the integrity of the core of the city. All of these commercial properties are tax-paying entities.

:I repeat, the combined income from all of these business interests is relatively small and would not keep the work going for longer than a very brief period.

:''I should like to add, parenthetically for your information, that the living allowances given the General Authorities, which are very modest in comparison with executive compensation in industry and the professions, come from this business income and not from the tithing of the people.''{{ref|hinckley1}}

===No professional ministers===

There can be no doubt that the Church ''does'' have an unpaid ministry. More precisely, it does not have a ''professional'' clergy. Consider:
* the vast majority of leadership positions in the Church are filled by those who receive absolutely no financial compensation. This includes bishops, stake presidents, area authority seventies, Relief Society presidents, priests, teachers, deacons, elders, missionaries, etc.
* the Church has no professional ministry — one does not "go into" the priesthood in Mormonism as a form of employment. The Church believes that "a man must be called of God, by prophecy, and by the laying on of hands by those who are in authority, to preach the Gospel and administer in the ordinances thereof."{{ref|5thart}} No one can enter Church ecclesiastical government or administration as a career.
* those few Church leaders who receive a living allowance have already served for many years in unpaid, volunteer positions of Church leadership, from which they derived no financial gain, and from which they could have had little expectation of making their livelihood by being elevated to high positions in Church administration
* the Book of Mormon makes provision for Church leaders to be supported by donations ''if'' they are in a position of financial need: "all their priests and teachers should labor with their own hands for their support, in all cases save it were in sickness, or in much want; and doing these things, they did abound in the grace of God."{{ref|bom1}}
* general authorities used sit on the board of directors of Church-owned businesses. This practice was discontinued in 1996.{{ref|board1}}

==Conclusion==

It is somewhat hypocritical for critics of the Church to complain about the use of Church funds, to which they do not contribute, to help leaders, whom they do not sustain. No one who examines the schedule or workload of the general authorites can claim that these men are looking for an "easy buck." They live modestly, work tirelessly, keep grueling travel schedules, and continue doing so well past an age when others retire. They are also demonstrably men of education and accomplishment; one can hardly claim that they were unsuited for work in the world given their accomlishments prior to being called to full-time Church service. No tithing funds provide for stipends; such funds are drawn from business income earned by Church investments.

As with many things, this issue boils down to a question of the essentials—are the leaders of the Church called of God, by prophecy? Is their direction inspired? If so, then their receipt of funds from Church business interests causes us little concern. If one does not believe that they are inspired, then one must confront far more troubling issues than whether someone is receiving a living stipend.

==Endnotes==
#{{note|hinckley1}} {{Ensign1|author=Gordon B. Hinckley|article=Questions and Answers|date=November 1985|start=49}} (emphasis added){{link|url=http://library.lds.org/nxt/gateway.dll/Magazines/Ensign/1985.htm/ensign%20november%201985%20.htm/questions%20and%20answers.htm?fn=document-frameset.htm$f=templates$3.0}}
#{{note|5thart}} {{scripture||A+of+F|1|5}}
#{{note|bom1}} {{s||Mosiah|27|5}}
#{{note|board1}} Lynn Arave, "LDS programs evolve over the years," ''Deseret Morning News'' (30 September 2006). {{link|url=http://www.deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,650194860,00.html}}

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
{{LyingWiki}}

Mormonism and church integrity/Accusations of hypocrisy in Church practices

2007-03-24T03:36:57Z

MikeClark: /* Conclusion */

==Criticism==

Critics claim that the Church, as a corporate entity, controls business properties that are not consistent with its stated purposes. Examples include:
* claims that the Church owns controlling stock in the Coca-Cola company
* claims that the Church owns stock in tobacco companies
* claims that the Church owns stock in alcohol companies

==Response==

The Church has what is called the "donations in kind" office that manages issues related to real estate, stocks and bonds, and other "non-cash" contributions. Interested parties can call Church headquarters and ask to be connected to this department, which will provides frank information about the Church's policy in this area.

It is the Church's practice to automatically liquidate all stocks/bonds provided to the donations in kind office as soon as they can be sold. Any stock donations made to the Church are never held by the Church or its corporations, but are converted into cash and then used for Church purposes.

The church receives a lot of these types of donations because of the favorable tax treatment the donor receives. In the United States, the IRS code allows for an individual who has a long term potential capital gain in a stock (i.e., they have owned it for more than 1 year) to donate the stock to a non-profit organization and receive a tax deductible donation credit against their taxes based on the full value of the holding ''without'' having to also recognize the gain and be taxed on the gain.

For example, if you bought stock for $10 and donate when it is worth $110, you get to remove $110 from your taxable earnings (which at the 33% tax bracket benefits you with not paying $36 in taxes). If you had sold the stock and donated the money, you would have had to realize a gain of $100 and had to pay taxes on that ($33), and then you would get the credit for the donation which would offset the gain.

As can be seen, when one can donate without selling, one essentially gets the best of both worlds, and it can result in substantial tax savings, with no loss to the charity to which one is donating. For this reason, estates that make sizeable donations to the Church usually do so with long term capital holdings, like stock, in order to realize the greatest tax benefits. This means that such donations are a very common event in Church finances.

Because the Church can neither control which stocks are donated, nor which stocks are in mutual fund shares that are donated, there have doubtless been times when interest in companies whose products are not in keeping with Church standards have been donated. Furthermore, stock index funds contain investments in all the stocks in that index (such as the Dow Jones Industrials, the S&P 500, and the Willshire 5000). Usually, this includes companies in industries inconsistent with the Church position.

The financial data for every publicly-traded corporation (i.e., a corporation with stock for sale at a stock exchange) is held in the Edgar data base of the Securities and Exchange Commission. This data is publically available on-line, at such sites as:
* [http://www.sec.gov http://www.sec.gov]
* [http://www.freeedgar.com http://www.freeedgar.com]
* [http://finance.yahoo.com http://finance.yahoo.com]

This data includes a list of "significant shareholders," which are typically those who own >5% of the total stock price. Any critic who claims the Church has on-going interest in a company should prove the claim by providing data showing that the Church indeed holds significant interest.

There have thus been instances in the past where reportable donations were made (>5%), and when the church received and then liquidated the holdings as a matter of public record. Yet, this does not mean that the Church purchased stock in these companies, or had continued to profit from stock held in such companies. The Church merely received a donation, which it liquidated in accordance with its standard financial practices.

==Conclusion==
It may be technically true that for a few minutes, hours, or days, the Church has been at least part owner of some companies whose products or behavior does not match the Church's interests or standards. However, such claims as used by critics are designed to mislead, since the Church did not seek interest in any such company, and sells its interest as soon as it acquires it.

The Church does not refuse to accept any lawfully traded security based on the products they sell, because all such donations are treated equally—they are sold.

==Endnotes==

''None''

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
{{LyingWiki}}
{{WoWWiki}}

===FAIR web site===
{{WoWFAIR}}

===External links===
* "Does the Mormon Church Own the Coca-Cola Company?" ''Snopes.com'' {{link|url=http://www.snopes.com/cokelore/mormon.asp}}
* {{Newera1|author=N. Eldon Tanner|article=Q&A: Questions and Answers|date=July 1975|start=50}}{{link|url=http://library.lds.org/nxt/gateway.dll/Magazines/NewEra/1975.htm/new%20era%20july%201975.htm/qampa%20questions%20and%20answers.htm?fn=document-frameset.htm$f=templates$3.0#LPTOC4}}
{{WoWLinks}}

===Printed material===
{{WoWPrint}}

Word of Wisdom/Cola drinks and caffeine

2007-03-24T03:05:26Z

MikeClark: /* Conclusion */ lightened up!

{{question}}

==Question==

Is it true that cola drinks (e.g. Coke, Pepsi, Dr Pepper) are forbidden to members of the Church?

==Answer==

Spencer W. Kimball made his own and the Church's view of cola drinks clear:

:I never drink any of the cola drinks and my personal hope would be that no one would. However, they are not included in the Word of Wisdom in its technical application. I quote from a letter from the secretary to the First Presidency, 'But the spirit of the Word of Wisdom would be violated by the drinking or eating of anything that contained a habit-forming drug.' With reference to the cola drinks, the Church has never officially taken any attitude on this at but I personally do not put them in the class as with the tea and coffee because the Lord specifically mentioned them [the hot drinks].{{ref|swk1}}

Bruce R. McConkie observed:

:Some unstable people become cranks...There is no prohibition in Section 89 as to the eating of white sugar, cocoa, chocolate...or anything else except items classified under tea, coffee, tobacco and liquor. If some particular food disagrees with an individual, then that person should act accordingly without reference to the prohibitions in this particular law of health.{{ref|brm1}}

President Heber J. Grant was encouraged to forbid cola drinks officially, but declined to do so:

:On October 15, 1924, representatives of the Coca-Cola Company called on President Grant to complain that non-Mormon Dr. T. B. Beatty, state Health Director, was using the church organization to assist in an attack on Coca-Cola. They asked President Grant to stop him, but he refused at first, saying that he himself had advised Mormons not to drink the beverage. Beatty, however, had been claiming that there was four to five times as much caffeine in Coke as in coffee, when in fact, as the representatives showed, there were approximately 1.7 grains in a cup of coffee and approximately .43 grains or about a fourth as much in a equivalent amount of Coke. After a second meeting, President Grant said that he was "sure I have not the slightest desire to recommend that the people leave Coca-Cola alone if this amount is absolutely harmless, which they claim it is." Beatty, however, insisted that he would still recommend against its use by children. The question was left unresolved, and evidence indicates that while the First Presidency has taken no official stand on the use of cola drinks, some members urge abstinence.{{ref|grant1}}

An official statement of policy from the First Presidency is available:

:With reference to cola drinks, the Church has never officially taken a position on this matter, but the leaders of the Church have advised, and we do now specifically advise, against the use of any drink containing harmful habit-forming drugs under circumstances that would result in acquiring the habit. Any beverage that contains ingredients harmful to the body should be avoided.{{ref|1stpres}}

==Conclusion==
Many members of the Church abstain from cola drinks as part of their personal application of the Word of Wisdom. But, use of cola products does not result in a restriction of Church privileges, while the use of coffee, tea, tobacco, alcohol, or illicit drugs certainly would.

==Endnotes==

#{{note|swk1}} {{TSWK1|start=202}}
#{{note|brm1}} {{MD|article=Word of Wisdom|start=845|end=846}}{{GL1|url=http://gospelink.com/library/doc?book_doc_id=210556}}
#{{note|grant1}} {{Dialogue|author=Thomas G. Alexander|article=The Word of Wisdom: From Principle to Requirement|date=Autumn 1981|num=3|vol=14|start=84|end=85}}{{link|url=http://content.lib.utah.edu/cgi-bin/docviewer.exe?CISOROOT=/dialogue&CISOPTR=6654&CISOSHOW=6589}}
#{{note|1stpres}} {{Dialogue1|author=Lester E. Bush, Jr., ed.|article=Mormon Medical Ethical Guidelines|date=Fall 1979|num=3|vol=12|start=103|}}{{link|url=http://content.lib.utah.edu/cdm4/document.php?CISOROOT=/dialogue&CISOPTR=1947&REC=5}}

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
{{WoWWiki}}

===FAIR web site===
{{WoWFAIR}}
===External links===
*{{Ensign1|author=Clifford J. Stratton|article=Caffeine—The Subtle Addiction|date=June 1988|start=60}}{{link|url=http://library.lds.org/nxt/gateway.dll/Magazines/Ensign/1988.htm/ensign%20june%201988.htm/research%20and%20perspectives.htm?fn=document-frame.htm&f=templates&2.0}}
{{WoWLinks}}

===Printed material===
{{WoWPrint}}

Holy Ghost/Burning in the bosom

2007-03-23T19:41:50Z

MikeClark: /* Sectarian critics inconsistent */

{{HolyGhostPortal}}

==Criticism==
Critics complain that the LDS appeal to "revelation" or a "burning in the bosom" is subjective, emotion-based, and thus unreliable and susceptible to self-deception.

Sectarian critics also belittle appeals to spiritual experiences, comparing them to "warm fuzzies," or merely something "felt by simply watching a Hollywood movie."

===Source(s) of the criticism===
* Burning in the bosom is something "felt by simply watching a Hollywood movie." {{SearchForTheTruthDVD}}

==Response==

===Sectarian critics inconsistent===

It is strange that sectarian critics fault appeals to a "burning in the bosom."

Following Jesus' resurrection, He walked with two disciples on the road to Emmaus. They did not recognize Jesus, but listened to Him as "he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself" ({{s||Luke|24|27}}).

After breaking bread with them, Jesus was revealed to the disciples, and vanished from their sight.

Interestingly, they did not say to each other, "We should have known it was Jesus because of his scriptural teaching." Rather, they said:

:Did not our heart burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and while he opened to us the scriptures?({{s||Luke|24|32}})

Would the critics likewise dismiss Jesus' disciples' witness because it was a "burning in the bosom"? Would they characterize this experience as merely the emotional rush of a Hollywood film?

===Misunderstanding or mis-stating===

Critics fundamentally misunderstand or misstate the LDS revelatory experience if they think it is exclusively or primarily “emotional.” The united witness of mind and heart is key in LDS doctrine.

An LDS “spiritual” experience has as much—or more—intellectual content as it does emotions of peace or joy. Oliver Cowdery received the following revelation through Joseph Smith, and it alludes to previous revelation given to Oliver privately:

:Verily, verily, I say unto you, if you desire a further witness, cast your mind upon the night that you cried unto me in your heart, that you might know concerning the truth of these things.
:Did I not speak peace to your mind concerning the matter? What greater witness can you have than from God? ([http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/6/22#23 D&C 6:22–23]).

Notice the information spoken to the “mind,” and the peace then follows. And, the solution for later doubts or concerns is not reliance on “a feeling,” but an admonition to recall specific information communicated earlier.

This matches the revelatory pattern explained later to Oliver:

:Behold, you have not understood; you have supposed that I would give it unto you, when you took no thought save it was to ask me.
:But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.
:But if it be not right you shall have no such feelings, but you shall have a stupor of thought that shall cause you to forget the thing which is wrong… ([http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/9/7#9 D&C 9:7–9]).

Again, the united witness of intellect and heart are essential. If either does not agree, then revelation has not confirmed the matter under consideration. Anyone who relies exclusively on a "feeling" does not understand or obey LDS teaching on this matter.

To be sure, many members will talk about how they “felt” when they prayed. It is to fundamentally misunderstand these experiences, however, if we assume (as hostile critics often do) that this talk of “feeling” means simply—or only, or primarily—“emotion.” The LDS member is stymied, in a sense, because there is no good word for what happens that doesn’t also have other secular connotations which critics could misinterpret if they chose.

Hugh Nibley’s description of the critic is apt:

:He cannot conceive how anyone could possibly acquire knowledge by any method other than his. He cannot believe that any man has experienced anything which he has not experienced. . . . ‘I have never seen a vision,' says the [skeptic], ‘therefore, Joseph Smith never had one. I have seen dreams [or had emotionally moving experiences], therefore, I will allow him that.'”{{ref|Nibley1}}

==Conclusion==

Elder Dallin H. Oaks made the LDS position on revelation and "burning in the bosom" clear:

:What does a “burning in the bosom” mean? Does it need to be a feeling of caloric heat, like the burning produced by combustion? If that is the meaning, I have never had a burning in the bosom. Surely, the word “burning” in this scripture signifies a feeling of comfort and serenity. That is the witness many receive. That is the way revelation works.{{ref|Oaks1}}

==Endnotes==

#{{note|Nibley1}} {{Nibley3_1|start=31}}
#{{note|Oaks1}} {{Ensign1 |author=Dallin H. Oaks|article=Teaching and Learning by the Spirit|date=March 1997|start=14.}}{{link|url=http://library.lds.org/nxt/gateway.dll/Magazines/Ensign/1997.htm/ensign%20march%201997.htm/teaching%20and%20learning%20by%20the%20spirit.htm}}

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
{{HolyGhostwiki}}

===FAIR web site===
{{HolyGhostFAIR}}
===External links===
{{HolyGhostLinks}}

===Printed material===
{{HolyGhostPrint}}

Question: Why is the Masonic symbol of the "All Seeing Eye" present on the Salt Lake Temple?

2006-11-11T03:49:49Z

MikeClark: /* Answer */

{{templedisclaimer}}<br>
{{question}}<br>
{{draft}}

==Question==

The Masonic symbol of the "All Seeing Eye" was at one time displayed by the character of Satan during the LDS endowment, along with the Masonic square and compass. Does this suggest that Joseph Smith was trying to teach that Masonry was evil, or was imitating Masonic ritual?

==Answer==
The All Seeing Eye, as well as the Square and Compasses and many other similar symbols, were displayed by the Satan character during the endowment's ritual drama.{{ref|gk1}}

These same symbols can be found both on the exterior of the Salt Lake Temple as well as in the interior paintings.

Why would these images be used to represent Satan's "power and priesthoods"? FAIR is aware of no writing which addresses this matter, but it seems logical to conclude that the symbols were used to show how Satan can usurp the symbols of good. In this instance, these symbols are used by the Mason to teach a variety of principles:
* the All Seeing Eye (of God) represents God's omniscience
* the Square represents virtue or rectitude
* the Compasses circumscribe our passions

Satan's appropriation of these symbols demonstrates his tendency to be the great counterfeiter; he seizes on good or even holy things, adopts them, and twists them to his own purposes. In doing so, he ultimately inverts and perverts their meaning.

The lesson here was that just because someone has the appearance of Godliness, just because he comes before you with the symbols of good does not make him Godly or good. One should, as the endowment teaches, look for true messengers from God, having genuine authority and not merely the outer trappings of such.

In the end simply having the symbols is not enough.

Rather one seeks those who have, as the Masonic ritual says, "squared [their] lives and circumscribe[d] [their] passions".

Today, of course, there is no reference to the All Seeing Eye and the other symbols. We no longer live in a world steeped in symbols, as was the case when the endowment was first developed. The decline of Masonry as a social institution means that (as this question demonstrates) such symbols confuse rather than enlighten the modern member of the Church. Therefore, these symbols are not used in the present endowment—as we have seen, the symbol is not the key, but rather the underlying message or truth being taught. If the symbol does not help teach the truth, it is of no real purpose.

==Endnotes==

#{{note|gk1}}This article was created by Greg Kearney, Franklin Lodge #123 A.F. & A.M. of Maine, and includes edits by other FAIRwiki editors.

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
{{MasonryWiki}}

===FAIR web site===
{{MasonryFAIR}}

===External links===
{{MasonryLinks}}

===Printed material===
{{MasonryPrint}}

Question: Why do Mormons follow the practice of most Christians by resting and worshiping on Sunday?

2006-10-22T06:20:06Z

MikeClark: /* Biblical evidence */ reworded a paragraph & a few other changes

{{EarlyChristianityPortal}}
{{question}}
<br>{{draft}}
==Question==
The Old Testament commands men to rest on the Sabbath, the seventh day of the week. Why do Mormons then follow the practice of most Christians by resting and worshiping on Sunday?

==Answer==
We believe the Lord's day ({{s||Revelation|1|10}}) to be the first day of the week.

This understanding is not unique to the Latter-day Saints; in fact, it has its origins early in the Christian century.

===Biblical evidence===

There is no question that the Old Testament refers to the Sabbath being on the seventh day — but, it is important to remember that the Old Testament law and practice was substantially changed in the early Christian church.

As {{s||Hebrews|7|12}} says

:For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

The Mosiac law was fulfilled and so worship was altered, and this included the Sabbath as well.

To be consistent, advocates of the Old Testament Sabbath should also keep the seventh month of every year, and the seventh year as sabbaths also. And in the seventh year, the fields which you farmed would have to be left to the poor and to the beasts of the field. You would also have to release all debts owed to you in this selfsame year. Other requirements that would still be in force would include the preparation of all food the evening before the sabbath, and you wouldn't be able to kindle a fire on the Sabbath ({{s||Exodus|35|3}}). And those breaking the Sabbath would have to be put to death ({{s||Exodus|31|14-17}})! This view of Sabbath worship is not the same as that spoken of in the New Testament.

The Acts of the Apostles tells us

:And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.{{s||Acts|20|7}}

Thus, in the earliest days of Christian worship, a group of Christ's followers gathered together in a house (where Church meetings were held in those days) on Sunday, where bread was broken (a term used for the sacrament or communion ({s|1|Corinthians|11|24}}), while a Church leader teaches of Christ. This sounds like a Church meeting held on the Sabbath.

===Early Christian authors on the Christian Sabbath===

Other Christian authors not found in the Bible support this view of Acts.

Ignatius (died A.D. 98–117) was taught by John the Apostle, and he understood what the Lord's day meant in John's Book of Revelation. He said

:if, then, those who walked in ancient customs came to a new hope, no longer sabbathing, but living by the Lord's day, on which we came to life through Him and through his death....

Ignatius makes a distinction between "sabbathing" (i.e. observing the Jewish Sabbath on Saturday) and the "Lord's day" (the first day of the week). He continues:

:let every friend of Christ keep the Lord’s Day as a festival, the resurrection-day, the queen and chief of all the days [of the week]. Looking forward to this, the prophet declared, “To the end, for the eighth day,” on which our life both sprang up again, and the victory over death was obtained in Christ, whom the children of perdition, the enemies of the Saviour, deny, “whose god is their belly, who mind earthly things,” ({{s||Phillipians|3|18-19}}) who are “lovers of pleasure, and not lovers of God, having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof,” ({{s|2|Timothy|3|4}}). These make merchandise for Christ, corrupting His word, and giving up Jesus to sale; they are corrupters of women, and covetous of other mens possessions, swallowing up wealth insatiably; from whom may ye be delivered by the mercy of God through our Lord Jesus Christ!{{ref|fn1}}

Here he gives a little more detail on the Lord's day. It is the "eighth day," or the first day of the week, and can be understood in Justin Martyr's (A.D. 100–165) teachings as such:

:The command of circumcision, again, bidding [them] always circumcise the children on the eighth day, was a type of the true circumcision, by which we are circumcised from deceit and iniquity through Him who rose from the dead on the first day after the Sabbath, [namely through] our Lord Jesus Christ. For the first day after the Sabbath, remaining the first of all the days , is called, however, the eighth, according to the number of all the days of the cycle, and [yet] remains the first.{{ref|fn2}}

Justin also wrote:

:the day of the sun is the day on which we all gather in a common meeting, because it is the first
day, the day on which God, changing darkness and matter, created the world; and it is the day on which Jesus Christ our Savior rose from the dead for He was crucified on the day before that of
“kronos” (Greek counter part of the Roman god Saturn which is where Saturday gets its name); and on
the day after that of “kronos”, which is the day of the sun (Sunday), He appeared to His Apostles
and disciples, and taught them these things which we have also submitted to you for your consideration.

He also taught

:and on the day called Sunday, all who live in cities or in the country gather together in to one place, and the memoirs of the Apostles or the writings of the Prophets are read as long as time permits; then when the reader has ceased, the President verbally instructs and exhorts to imitation of these good things{{ref|fn3}}

Here, Justin points out that Christians worshipped on Sunday. He also says:

:But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead. For He was crucified on the day before that of Saturn (Saturday); and on the day after that of Saturn, which is the day of the Sun, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, He taught them these things, which we have submitted to you also for your consideration.{{ref|fn4}}

The Epistle of Barnabas, which purports to have been written by Barnabas, Paul's missionary companion, reads,

:Lastly he says to them, I cannot stand your new moons and your Sabbaths. Consider what he means by it: the Sabbaths, he says, that you now keep are not acceptable to me, but only those which I have made, when resting from all things I shall begin the eighth day, that is, the beginning of the other world." Wherefore, also, we keep the eighth day with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead. And when He had manifested Himself, He ascended into the heavens.{{ref|fn5}}

In the ''Didache'', which was written around A.D. 140, it says

:on the Lord's day of the Lord gather together, break bread and give thanks, after confessing your transgressions so that your sacrifice may be pure.{{ref|fn9}}{{nc}}

Again, we see that the Christians are told, on the Lords day (Sunday) they are to gather together and meet for the celebration of the Lord's supper (LDS readers would call this the "sacrament.")

The redundancy of “the Lord's day of the Lord” in Greek indicates that the term “Lord's day” had
already become a common usage for Sunday, so much so that it is now used as a distinct term
apart from its root meaning.{{ref|fn10}}

Augustine (A.D. 354–430) says:

:"the Apostles decreed that Sunday must be kept holy" and "every lover of Christ celebrates the Lords day, consecrated to the resurrection of Christ, as the queen and chief of all days." {{ref|fn6}} {{nc}}

===Biblical Commentators===

Various Biblical commentators also agree that the Sabbath as observed by the early Christians was Sunday:

Dr. Adam Clark, in his ''Commentary'' treating Revelation 1:10, says:

:'The Lord's day' the first day of the week, observed as the Christian sabbath, because on it Jesus Christ rose from the dead: therefore it was called the Lords day; and has taken place of the Jewish sabbath, throughout the Christian world.{{ref|fn7}}{{nc}}

Dr. Thomas Scott, in his ''Commentary'' dealing with this same verse, says:

This was 'on the Lord's day' which can be meant of no other, than the day on which the Lord Jesus arose from the dead, even "the first day of the week": and it is conclusive proof, that the first day was set apart, and kept holy, by the primitive Christians, in commemoration of the great event: for on what other account could it have been thus mentioned!"{{ref|fn8}}{{nc}}

In the Jameson, Fausett, and Brown's Commentary on this same passage, they write:

:...on the Lords day--Though forcibly detained from Church communion with the brethren in the
sanctuary on the Lord's day, the weekly commemoration of the resurrection, John was holding
spiritual communion with them. This is the earliest mention of the term 'the Lord's day!' But the
consecration of the day to worship, almsgiving, and the Lord's supper, is implied, {{s||Acts|20|7}};{{s|1|Corinthians|16|2}}, cf. {{s||John|20|19-26}}. The name corresponds to 'the Lord's supper,' {{s|1|Corinthians|11|20}}. Ignatius seems to allude to 'the Lord's day' (''ad. Magnes'', 9) and Irenaeus in the ''Quaest. ad Orthod''. (in Justin Martyr). Justin Martyr ''Apology'' 2:98 &c. 'On Sunday we hold our joint meeting; for the first day is that on which God, having removed darkness and chaos, made the world, and Jesus Christ our Savior rose from the dead. On the day before Saturday they crucified Him, and on the day after Saturday, which is Sunday, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, he taught these things.' To the Lord's day Pliny doubtless refers (Ex 97, B10), 'The Christians on a fixed day before dawn meet and sing a hymn to Christ as God.'"{{ref|fn11}}{{nc}}

===Non-Christian authors===

The Roman historians, Suetonius and Pliny, who lived and wrote in the first centuries of the
Christian era, during the bloody martyr ages, are good witnesses in this problem. As they were
neither Christians nor Jews, but heathens, and not concerned in the controversy in any respect, their incidental historic testimony is compelling.

They report that Christians charged with violating Roman law through their worship were asked: "Dominicum servaste?" — "Hast thou kept the Lord's day?" The Christian responded: "Christianus sum" — "I am a Christian." "Intermittere non possum" — "I can not omit it." This response doomed the Christian to martyrdom.{{ref|pliny1}}{{nc}}

To understanding the above exchange, it is important to note that the Jewish Sabbath was never was called "the Lord's day," but simply "the Sabbath day." If the early Christians had kept the seventh day, they would have been asked: "Sabbaticum servaste?" — "Hast thou kept the Sabbath day?" But this question never was asked by their persecutors. It is historically untenable to deny that the Lord's day was kept from the Apostolic age onward.

It is a significant fact that the day of Pentecost, upon which day the apostles received
their spiritual endowment by the outpouring of the Holy Ghost, “that year fell on the first day of the week”—that is, Sunday.{{ref|fn12}}

==Conclusion==

Latter-day Saints do not base their worship practices on an analysis of early Christian history, or on the comments of scholars in Biblical commentaries, though these sources can confirm Church teachings. Rather, the Saints follow the guidance of a living prophet. However, it seems clear that the Latter-day Saint practice of observing the day of rest and worship on Sunday—like most of the Christian world—is consistent with the earliest Christian practice of which we have record.

Interestingly, however, the most important aspect of Sabbath worship for the LDS seems to be the worship, and not the day on which it is held. Most LDS worship occurs on Sunday. General Authorities, who must often travel on conference assignments on Sunday, fast and receive the sacrament weekly on Thursdays. Church branches in Israel worship on Saturday. Branches in Muslim countires, such as Egypt, meet on Friday, the Muslim holy day.{{ref|worshipdays1}} Wrote one account of the Church in Israel:

:Jersualem is home to three major religions: Judaism, Christianity, and Islam. None of the three shares the same day of worship. Islam recognizes Friday as a holy day, Judaism celebrates the Sabbath on Saturday, while Christianity generally adheres to a Sunday day of worship. These differences posed significant challenges in the lives of the Saints living in the Holy Land, and David Galbraith posed questions regarding this matter to President Lee during the Prophet's visit to Jerusalem [in September 1972].

:Following President Lee's visit, branch president David Galbraith wrote a letter to the First Presidency wherein he outlined four major concerns and formally recommended that the day of worship for Latter-day Saints in the Holy Land be changed. The four concerns were as follows: First, for the Jews, public transportation ceases on Saturday, stores and places of entertainment are closed, and in Jerusalem the streets are full of families going to and from their synagogues. Second, Sunday, on the other hand, is a normal working day. Those attending the universities have classes, many of the children have school, and, in fact, everyone except those in the diplomatic corps have other obligations on that day. Third, the members were scattered throughout the country, and the majority relied on public transportation. It would be impossible to hold late afternoon or evening services on Sunday. Fourth, the members of the Church had been holding their meetings on the Jewish Sabbath rather than Sunday for some time with at least the tacit approval of the mission.

:Two months after President Harold B. Lee's visit to the Holy Land, he authorized President David Galbraith to conduct worship services in Israel on the Jewish Sabbath (Saturday). This authorization is dated November 20, 1972. This decision in Israel served as a precedent to include Friday observance as a day of worship in countries of primarily Islamic populations, such as Egypt and Jordan.{{ref|alterday1}}

Clearly, the Lord is far more concerned that His people worship Him regularly, and that they set aside a day to dedicate to him. He does not wish us to contend about a matter as trivial as the day dedicated to his worship.(See: {{s|3|Nephi|11|29-30}}, {{s||Colossians|2|16}}.)

Early Christians chose a new sabbath day, partly to separate themselves from their Jewish roots, and to make clear that the Christian covenant of grace was a ''new'' covenant or testament from the Mosaic law.

The modern Church, guided by prophets and apostles, does not seek contention with others over the "proper" day of worship; rather, they invite all to worship and come unto Christ. This tends to be done on the day which accords best with the practices and patterns of the culture in which they find themselves.

==Endnotes==

#{{note|fn1}} {{Anf1| author=Irenaeus|article=Ignatius to the Magnesians|vol=1|citation=|start=63}}
#{{note|fn2}}{{Anf1| author=Justin Martyr|article=Dialogue with Trypho|vol=1|citation=Chapter 41|start=215}}
#{{note|fn3}}{{Anf1| author=Justin Martyr|article=First Apology|vol=1|citation=Chapter 67|start=186}}
#{{note|fn4}} {{Anf1| author=Justin Martyr|article=First Apology|vol=1|citation=Chapter 67|start=186}}
#{{note|fn5}} {{Anf1| author=Attributed to Barnabas|article=Epistle of Barnabas|vol=1|citation=Chapter 15|start=147}}
#{{note|fn9}}{{nc}}
#{{note|fn10}} William A. Jurgens, ''The Faith of the Early Fathers'', Volume 1, (Liturgical Press, 1970), 5. ISBN 0814604323.
#{{note|fn6}} {{NC}}
#{{note|fn7}} {{nc}}
#{{note|fn8}} {{nc}}
#{{note|fn11}}{{nc}}
#{{note|pliny1}}{{nc}}
#{{note|fn12}} "Lord's day," in ''Smith's Bible Dictionary'' (Hackett and Abbott’s edition) 2:1677. See slso ''First Name'' Bramhall, "Discourse on the Sabbath and the Lords day," in ''Need Title'' (Oxford edition, ''YEAR?'') vol. 5:51—“and when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in place.” It is very possible that all the believers were in "one place" was because they were worshipping together.{{NeedCite}}''Note need for more info on these references''
#{{note|worshipdays1}} Personal communication from those who have lived in Israel and Egypt, FAIR e-mail list.
#{{note|alterday1}} LaMar C. Berrett and Blair G. Van Dyke, ''Holy Lands: A History of the Latter-day Saints in the Near East'' (American Fork, Utah: Covenant Communications, 2005), 372–373.

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
{{ApostasyWiki}}

===FAIR web site===
{{ApostasyFAIR}}

===External links===
{{ApostasyLinks}}

===Printed material===
{{ApostasyPrint}}

Changes to the temple endowment

2006-08-26T21:57:19Z

MikeClark: /* Conclusion */

{{question}}<br>
{{templedisclaimer}}
==Question==
Latter-day Saints believe that the Temple endowment is an eternal ordinance that Joseph Smith received by revelation from God. Why, then, have changes been made to it several times since it was first revealed?

==Response==
God’s directives and how He deals with His people often vary according to His people’s understanding and needs. God doesn’t tell everyone to build an ark and wait for a flood. Changes most often occur as a result of God dealing with his children according to their changing circumstances.

We know, for example, that major changes in practices took place during Christ’s ministry. Christ fulfilled the Law of Moses and practices associated with that law were no longer necessary. Changes also took place after Christ's earthly ministry. For example, Christ originally taught the gospel only to the lost sheep of the House of Israel (Matt. 15:24) and forbade his apostles from going to the Gentiles (Matt. 10:5-6). After Christ’s death Peter was commanded by an angel to take the gospel to all people (Acts 10, 11; Matt 28:19). Following Christ’s mortal ministry the practice of circumcision also became unnecessary (Acts 15, Gal. 6:15). Changes in the Church are not only common, but often necessary. Such changes, however, must be done by inspiration or revelation from the head of the Church, which is Christ.

There are absolute truths and relative truths. Absolute truths (such as: God lives and Jesus is the Christ) do not change. Relative truths (such as: circumcision, plural marriage, and age of priesthood ordination) do change. Many relative truths deal with procedural issues, and how absolute truths are presented, rather than the absolute truths themselves. As new truths are revealed, previous revelations are modified to accommodate additional light. “But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, [and] there a little....” (Isaiah 28:13; D&C 98:12.) “That which is of God is light; and he that receiveth light and continueth in God, receiveth more light; and that light groweth brighter and brighter until the perfect day.” (D&C 50:23–24.)

That the temple ceremony has undergone changes, improvements, and refinements, should come as no surprise. Joseph Fielding Smith said that the “work of salvation for the dead came to the Prophet like every other doctrine—piecemeal. It was not revealed all at once.”

What has changed in the temple ceremony? It’s probably more important to understand what has not changed. What is the "endowment"? Brigham Young said:

"Your endowment is, to receive all those ordinances in the House of the Lord, which are necessary for you, after you have departed this life, to enable you to walk back to the presence of the Father, passing the angels who stand as sentinels, being enabled to give them the key words, the signs and tokens, pertaining to the Holy Priesthood, and gain your eternal exaltation in spite of earth and hell."

Joseph Smith said that the endowment is designed to give “a comprehensive view of our condition and true relation to God” by way of instruction and covenants. As noted by Brigham Young, important elements of the endowment include the key words, signs, and tokens. The vehicle by which these important elements are expressed, as well as other components of the endowment—such as penalties, and the dramatic presentation of the endowment—are less essential (relative truths). While the significance and purpose of the endowment remains unchanged, how God chooses to reveal the message and meaning of the endowment can change according to His direction. Thanks to continuing revelation, the endowment can be modified as our understanding changes. As Greg Kearney explains,

"When Joseph was first trying to communicate the truths of the endowment he used a ritual form familiar to the saints of his day. That ritual form was, in some respects, Masonic in nature. As the saints lost their connection to Masonry the symbolic meaning of the penalties and other Masonic elements was lost as well. They became meaningless to all but a few Latter-day Saint Freemasons. So the penalties were removed along with other elements both Masonic and non-Masonic which no longer served the purpose of communicating the truths of the endowment."

Although Joseph Smith received the principles of the endowment by revelation, he recognized that the presentation of the endowment could, and would, change. In May 1842, after the first endowment was given, the prophet Joseph told Brigham that the endowment was “not arranged perfectly” and he wanted Brigham to “organize and systematize” the ceremonies. In the process of so doing, Brigham claims to have gained more insight into the endowment.

In succeeding years, Brigham Young suggested that the presentation of the endowment could further evolve. On April 6, 1845, in a Nauvoo Conference, Brigham Young said that Joseph “did not receive every thing connected with the doctrine of redemption” in his lifetime, but instead “left the key” with the Brethren. “We have got to learn how to be faithful in a few things; you know the promise is, if we are faithful in a few things, we shall be made ruler over many things. If we improve upon small things, greater will be given unto us.”

The dramatic presentation of the endowment has undergone changes. Up until the dedication of the St. George Temple in 1877 the endowment teachings had passed on in oral form only. Brigham (as the sole survivor of the original group who received the endowment from Joseph Smith in 1842), was concerned that this ordinance be preserved as perfectly as possible. He enlisted the help of Brigham, Jr. and Wilford Woodruff, giving them the assignment to record the ceremonies so they could be taught to the temple workers. Wilford Woodruff recalled that President Young labored “all winter to get up a perfect form of Endowments as far as possible.” This indicates that the endowment may have varied slightly from the endowment of Joseph Smith.

Woodruff wrote that prior to this time they had “acted up to all the light and knowledge” they had, but they “felt that there was more to be revealed upon this subject than we had received.” After receiving revelation in the St. George Temple, “changes were made” to the endowment and Woodruff wrote that “we still have more changes to make, in order to satisfy our Heavenly Father, satisfy our dead and ourselves.” One of the changes was the addition of vicarious endowments for the dead. Although the doctrine concerning baptisms for the dead was revealed and performed under the direction of Joseph Smith, it wasn’t until January 11, 1877, in the St. George temple that the first endowments given in behalf of the dead were preformed. “Not long before,” notes Cowan, “President Young had told some temple workers that he had just learned by revelation “that it takes as full and complete a set of ordinances for the dead as for the living.” Sixteen years later, Wilford Woodruff met with the Quorum of the Twelve and four temple presidents to harmonize the various and “different” modes of endowment ceremonies.

As the prophets have recognized, a living Church with continuing revelation, will expect the Lord to add further light, correction, and modification, as the needs of His people, and their understanding changes.

==Conclusion==

Inasmunch as the Endowment was given of God through revelation and inspiration, God is perfectly capable of revealing and inspiring modifications to the Endowment according to the needs and understanding of the Lord's people, in order to more fully benefit them. That the presentation of the Endowment has evolved is more a testament to the active involvement of Deity in the spiritual life of His children than a once-given, forever-unchangeable rite whose deep meaning becomes lost as cultural changes render symbols once familiar into empty ciphers full of mystery and suspicion.

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
*Links to related articles in the wiki

===FAIR web site===
*[http://www.fairlds.org/apol/ai132.html Changes in temple ceremony] - FAIR Topical Guide
*[http://www.fairlds.org/apol/ai127.html Temples and temple work]- FAIR Topical Guide

===External links===
*[http://www.mormonmonastery.org/?cat=31 Historical Changes Relating to Temples] - Mormon Monastery

===Printed material===
*Printed resources whose text is not available online

Changes to the temple endowment

2006-08-26T21:57:06Z

MikeClark: /* Conclusion */

{{question}}<br>
{{templedisclaimer}}
==Question==
Latter-day Saints believe that the Temple endowment is an eternal ordinance that Joseph Smith received by revelation from God. Why, then, have changes been made to it several times since it was first revealed?

==Response==
God’s directives and how He deals with His people often vary according to His people’s understanding and needs. God doesn’t tell everyone to build an ark and wait for a flood. Changes most often occur as a result of God dealing with his children according to their changing circumstances.

We know, for example, that major changes in practices took place during Christ’s ministry. Christ fulfilled the Law of Moses and practices associated with that law were no longer necessary. Changes also took place after Christ's earthly ministry. For example, Christ originally taught the gospel only to the lost sheep of the House of Israel (Matt. 15:24) and forbade his apostles from going to the Gentiles (Matt. 10:5-6). After Christ’s death Peter was commanded by an angel to take the gospel to all people (Acts 10, 11; Matt 28:19). Following Christ’s mortal ministry the practice of circumcision also became unnecessary (Acts 15, Gal. 6:15). Changes in the Church are not only common, but often necessary. Such changes, however, must be done by inspiration or revelation from the head of the Church, which is Christ.

There are absolute truths and relative truths. Absolute truths (such as: God lives and Jesus is the Christ) do not change. Relative truths (such as: circumcision, plural marriage, and age of priesthood ordination) do change. Many relative truths deal with procedural issues, and how absolute truths are presented, rather than the absolute truths themselves. As new truths are revealed, previous revelations are modified to accommodate additional light. “But the word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, [and] there a little....” (Isaiah 28:13; D&C 98:12.) “That which is of God is light; and he that receiveth light and continueth in God, receiveth more light; and that light groweth brighter and brighter until the perfect day.” (D&C 50:23–24.)

That the temple ceremony has undergone changes, improvements, and refinements, should come as no surprise. Joseph Fielding Smith said that the “work of salvation for the dead came to the Prophet like every other doctrine—piecemeal. It was not revealed all at once.”

What has changed in the temple ceremony? It’s probably more important to understand what has not changed. What is the "endowment"? Brigham Young said:

"Your endowment is, to receive all those ordinances in the House of the Lord, which are necessary for you, after you have departed this life, to enable you to walk back to the presence of the Father, passing the angels who stand as sentinels, being enabled to give them the key words, the signs and tokens, pertaining to the Holy Priesthood, and gain your eternal exaltation in spite of earth and hell."

Joseph Smith said that the endowment is designed to give “a comprehensive view of our condition and true relation to God” by way of instruction and covenants. As noted by Brigham Young, important elements of the endowment include the key words, signs, and tokens. The vehicle by which these important elements are expressed, as well as other components of the endowment—such as penalties, and the dramatic presentation of the endowment—are less essential (relative truths). While the significance and purpose of the endowment remains unchanged, how God chooses to reveal the message and meaning of the endowment can change according to His direction. Thanks to continuing revelation, the endowment can be modified as our understanding changes. As Greg Kearney explains,

"When Joseph was first trying to communicate the truths of the endowment he used a ritual form familiar to the saints of his day. That ritual form was, in some respects, Masonic in nature. As the saints lost their connection to Masonry the symbolic meaning of the penalties and other Masonic elements was lost as well. They became meaningless to all but a few Latter-day Saint Freemasons. So the penalties were removed along with other elements both Masonic and non-Masonic which no longer served the purpose of communicating the truths of the endowment."

Although Joseph Smith received the principles of the endowment by revelation, he recognized that the presentation of the endowment could, and would, change. In May 1842, after the first endowment was given, the prophet Joseph told Brigham that the endowment was “not arranged perfectly” and he wanted Brigham to “organize and systematize” the ceremonies. In the process of so doing, Brigham claims to have gained more insight into the endowment.

In succeeding years, Brigham Young suggested that the presentation of the endowment could further evolve. On April 6, 1845, in a Nauvoo Conference, Brigham Young said that Joseph “did not receive every thing connected with the doctrine of redemption” in his lifetime, but instead “left the key” with the Brethren. “We have got to learn how to be faithful in a few things; you know the promise is, if we are faithful in a few things, we shall be made ruler over many things. If we improve upon small things, greater will be given unto us.”

The dramatic presentation of the endowment has undergone changes. Up until the dedication of the St. George Temple in 1877 the endowment teachings had passed on in oral form only. Brigham (as the sole survivor of the original group who received the endowment from Joseph Smith in 1842), was concerned that this ordinance be preserved as perfectly as possible. He enlisted the help of Brigham, Jr. and Wilford Woodruff, giving them the assignment to record the ceremonies so they could be taught to the temple workers. Wilford Woodruff recalled that President Young labored “all winter to get up a perfect form of Endowments as far as possible.” This indicates that the endowment may have varied slightly from the endowment of Joseph Smith.

Woodruff wrote that prior to this time they had “acted up to all the light and knowledge” they had, but they “felt that there was more to be revealed upon this subject than we had received.” After receiving revelation in the St. George Temple, “changes were made” to the endowment and Woodruff wrote that “we still have more changes to make, in order to satisfy our Heavenly Father, satisfy our dead and ourselves.” One of the changes was the addition of vicarious endowments for the dead. Although the doctrine concerning baptisms for the dead was revealed and performed under the direction of Joseph Smith, it wasn’t until January 11, 1877, in the St. George temple that the first endowments given in behalf of the dead were preformed. “Not long before,” notes Cowan, “President Young had told some temple workers that he had just learned by revelation “that it takes as full and complete a set of ordinances for the dead as for the living.” Sixteen years later, Wilford Woodruff met with the Quorum of the Twelve and four temple presidents to harmonize the various and “different” modes of endowment ceremonies.

As the prophets have recognized, a living Church with continuing revelation, will expect the Lord to add further light, correction, and modification, as the needs of His people, and their understanding changes.

==Conclusion==

A summary of the argument against the criticism.

Inasmunch as the Endowment was given of God through revelation and inspiration, God is perfectly capable of revealing and inspiring modifications to the Endowment according to the needs and understanding of the Lord's people, in order to more fully benefit them. That the presentation of the Endowment has evolved is more a testament to the active involvement of Deity in the spiritual life of His children than a once-given, forever-unchangeable rite whose deep meaning becomes lost as cultural changes render symbols once familiar into empty ciphers full of mystery and suspicion.

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
*Links to related articles in the wiki

===FAIR web site===
*[http://www.fairlds.org/apol/ai132.html Changes in temple ceremony] - FAIR Topical Guide
*[http://www.fairlds.org/apol/ai127.html Temples and temple work]- FAIR Topical Guide

===External links===
*[http://www.mormonmonastery.org/?cat=31 Historical Changes Relating to Temples] - Mormon Monastery

===Printed material===
*Printed resources whose text is not available online

Theory of Book of Mormon place names from Comoros Islands

2006-08-01T10:41:44Z

MikeClark: /* Response */

==Criticism==
Comoros is a small nation made up of three islands off the southeast coast of Africa. Its capital city is Moroni.

Some critics have claimed that Joseph Smith created the Book of Mormon names ''Cumorah'' and ''Moroni'' by copying them from a map of the Comoros islands.

===Source(s) of the criticism===
*RFM site

==Response==
[[Image:ComorosMap.gif|frame|right|Modern map of the Comoros Islands]]
This claim, like many efforts to explain away the Book of Mormon, commits the logical fallacy of the [[#Logical_fallacies#Appeal_to_probability | Appeal to probability]]. This fallacy argues that because something is even remotely ''possible'', it must be ''true.''

Pointing out a possible relationship like Comoros = Cumorah and Moroni = Moroni is not sufficient.

When the facts are examined, even the possiblity of Joseph seeing Comoros and Moroni recedes; the idea becomes absurd. The following Gazeteers from Joseph's era were consulted:

<table border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0">
<tr valign="top">
<td width="50%">'''Title'''</td>
<td width="50%">'''Relevant Contents'''</td>
</tr><tr valign="top">
<td>
''Mucullock's Universal Gazateer'', 2 vols (1843-4)</td>
<td>
2257 pages of double columned miniscule print, with no reference to Comoros Islands or Moroni.
</td>
</tr>
<tr valign="top">
<td>
''Morris' Universal Gazateer'' (1821)</td>
<td>
831 pages, no mention of Comoros or Moroni</td></tr>
<tr valign="top">
<td>
''Brookes Gazateer''
*1794 edition</td>
<td>
<br>
*Comora on p. 400, no mention of Moroni</td>
<tr valign="top">
<td>
*1819 edition</td>
<td>
*Comora, no mention of Moroni</td></tr>

<tr valign="top">
<td>
*1835 edition</td>
<td>
*Comoro on p. 214, no mention of Moroni</td></tr>
<tr valign="top">
<td>
*1843 edition</td>
<td>
*Comoro, no mention of Moroni</td></tr>
</tr>
</table>

There is no evidence that Joseph saw these maps, or any other, but if he had they would have provided little help.

Furthermore, it is unlikely that ''any'' source would have contained the name of "Moroni." That settlement did not become the capital city until 1876 (32 years after Joseph's death and 47 years after the publication of the Book of Mormon), when Sultan Sa'id Ali settled there. At that time it was only a small settlement. Even a century later, in 1958, its population was only 6500.

==Conclusion==
Advocacy of the Comoros/Moroni link seems an act of desperation. It has not been proved that Joseph saw the names, or that any source available to him linked them. Furthermore, latching on to two names in an obscure reference work does nothing to explain the incredible complexity and internal consistency of the Book of Mormon.

==Trivia==
In an episode of the TV game show ''Jeopardy,'' host Alex Trebek gave the answer, "Pronounced one way, it is the capitol of the Comoros Islands; pronounced another way, it is the name of the angel that appeared to Joseph Smith." (The question, of course, was "What is Moroni?")

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===

===FAIR web site===
*Links to articles on the FAIR web site; Topical Guide entries go first

===External links===
* Wikipedia entry on Comoros {{link|url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comoros}}
* Wikipedia entry on Moroni, Comoros {{link|url={{link|url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moroni%2C_Comoros}}
* Entry on Comoros in the ''CIA World Factbook'' {{link|url=http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/cn.html}}
* Gary Smith homepage {{link|url=http://www.geocities.com/rameumptom/bom/comoros.html}}

===Printed material===
*Printed resources whose text is not available online

Help:Table

2006-07-23T20:28:24Z

MikeClark:

This page gives you information about syntax to build wiki-tables.

== Pipe syntax tutorial ==

Although HTML table syntax also works, special [[wikicode]] can be used as a shortcut to create a table. The pipe ([[w:vertical bar|vertical bar]]) codes function exactly the same as [[w:HTML table|HTML table]] markup, so a knowledge of HTML table code will help in understanding pipe code. The shortcuts are as follows:
* The entire table is encased with curly brackets and a vertical bar character (a pipe). So use <code>'''{|'''</code> to begin a table, and <code>'''|}'''</code> to end it. Each one needs to be on its own line:
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red"><nowiki>{|</nowiki></span>
''table code goes here''
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red"><nowiki>|}</nowiki></span>
* An optional '''table [[caption]]''' is included with a line starting with a vertical bar and plus sign "<code>'''|+'''</code>" and the caption after it:
<nowiki>{|</nowiki>
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red"><nowiki>|+</nowiki> ''caption''</span>
''table code goes here''
<nowiki>|}</nowiki>
* To start a new '''table [[row]]''', type a vertical bar and a [[w:dash|dash]] on its own line: "<code>'''|-'''</code>". The codes for the cells in that row will start on the next line.
<nowiki>{|</nowiki>
<nowiki>|+</nowiki> The table's caption
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red"><nowiki>|-</nowiki></span>
''cell code goes here''
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red"><nowiki>|-</nowiki></span>
''cell code goes here''
<nowiki>|}</nowiki>
* Type the codes for each ''table [[w:cell|cell]]'' in the next row, starting with a bar:
<nowiki>{|</nowiki>
<nowiki>|+</nowiki> The table's caption
<nowiki>|-</nowiki>
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">|</span> ''cell codes go here''
<nowiki>|-</nowiki>
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">|</span> ''cells in the next row go here''
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">|</span> ''more cells in the same row here''
<nowiki>|}</nowiki>
* Cells can be separated with either a new line and new bar, or by a double bar "'''||'''" on the same line. Both produce the same output:
<nowiki>{|</nowiki>
<nowiki>|+</nowiki> The table's caption
<nowiki>|-</nowiki>
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">|Cell 1 || Cell 2 || Cell 3</span>
<nowiki>|-</nowiki>
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">|Cell A </span>
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">|Cell B</span>
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">|Cell C</span>
<nowiki>|}</nowiki>
* a row of '''[[w:column heading|column heading]]s''' is identified by using "!" instead of "|", and using "!!" instead of "||". Header cells typically render differently than regular cells, depending on the browser. They are often rendered in a bold font and centered.
<nowiki>{|</nowiki>
<nowiki>|+</nowiki> The table's caption
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">! Column heading 1 !! Column heading 2 !! Column heading 3</span>
<nowiki>|-</nowiki>
|Cell 1 || Cell 2 || Cell 3
<nowiki>|-</nowiki>
|Cell A
|Cell B
|Cell C
<nowiki>|}</nowiki>
* the first cell of a row is identified as '''[[w:row heading|row heading]]''' by starting the line with "!" instead of "|", and starting subsequent data cells on a new line.
<nowiki>{|</nowiki>
<nowiki>|+</nowiki> The table's caption
! Column heading 1 !! Column heading 2 !! Column heading 3
<nowiki>|-</nowiki>
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">! Row heading 1</span>
| Cell 2 || Cell 3
<nowiki>|-</nowiki>
<span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">! Row heading A</span>
|Cell B
|Cell C
<nowiki>|}</nowiki>
* Optional '''parameters''' can modify the behavior of cells, rows, or the entire table. For instance, a border could be added to the table:
<nowiki>{|</nowiki> <span style="font-weight:bold; color:red">border="1"</span>
<nowiki>|+</nowiki> The table's caption
! Column heading 1 !! Column heading 2 !! Column heading 3
<nowiki>|-</nowiki>
! Row heading 1
| Cell 2 || Cell 3
<nowiki>|-</nowiki>
! Row heading A
|Cell B
|Cell C
<nowiki>|}</nowiki>
The final table would display like this:
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| border="1"
|+ The table's caption
! Column heading 1 !! Column heading 2 !! Column heading 3
|-
! Row heading 1
| Cell 2 || Cell 3
|-
! Row heading A
|Cell B
|Cell C
|}
</blockquote>
The table parameters and cell parameters are the same as in [[w:HTML|HTML]], see [http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/struct/tables.html#edef-TABLE] and [[w:Table (HTML)|Table (HTML)]]. However, the <code>thead</code>, <code>tbody</code>, <code>tfoot</code>, <code>colgroup</code>, and <code>col</code> elements are currently not [[Help:HTML in wikitext#Permitted_HTML|supported in MediaWiki]].

A table can be useful even if none of the cells have content. For example, the background colors of cells can be changed with cell parameters, making the table into a diagram, like [[m:Template talk:Square 8x8 pentomino example]]. An "image" in the form of a table is much more convenient to edit than an uploaded image.

Each row must have the same number of cells as the other rows, so that the number of columns in the table remains consistent (unless there are cells which span several columns or rows, see colspan and rowspan in Mélange example below). For empty cells, use the non-breaking space <code>&nbsp;</code> as content to ensure that the cells are displayed.
To add a visible | into a table use <nowiki>|</nowiki> or &#124;

==Examples==

=== Simple example ===
Both of these generate the same output. Choose a style based on the amount of cells in each row and the total text inside each cell.

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{|
| Cell 1, row 1
| Cell 2, row 1
|-
| Cell 1, row 2
| Cell 2, row 2
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{|
| Cell 1, row 1 || Cell 2, row 1
|-
| Cell 1, row 2 || Cell 2, row 2
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{|
| Cell 1, row 1
| Cell 2, row 1
|-
| Cell 1, row 2
| Cell 2, row 2
|}
</blockquote>

===Multiplication table===

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| class="wikitable" style="text-align:center"
|+Multiplication table
|-
! &times; !! 1 !! 2 !! 3
|-
! 1
| 1 || 2 || 3
|-
! 2
| 2 || 4 || 6
|-
! 3
| 3 || 6 || 9
|-
! 4
| 4 || 8 || 12
|-
! 5
| 5 || 10 || 15
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| class="wikitable" style="text-align:center"
|+Multiplication table
|-
! × !! 1 !! 2 !! 3
|-
! 1
| 1 || 2 || 3
|-
! 2
| 2 || 4 || 6
|-
! 3
| 3 || 6 || 9
|-
! 4
| 4 || 8 || 12
|-
! 5
| 5 || 10 || 15
|}
</blockquote>

===Color; scope of parameters===

Two ways of specifying color of text and background for a single cell are as follows. The first form is preferred:

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{|
| style="background:red; color:white" | abc
| def
| bgcolor="red" | <font color="white"> ghi </font>
| jkl
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{|
| style="background:red; color:white" | abc
| def
| bgcolor="red" | <font color="white"> ghi </font>
| jkl
|}
</blockquote>

Like other parameters, colors can also be specified for a whole row or the whole table; parameters for a row override the value for the table, and those for a cell override those for a row:

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| style="background:yellow; color:green"
|-
| abc || def || ghi
|- style="background:red; color:white"
| jkl || mno || pqr
|-
| stu || style="background:silver" | vwx || yz
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| style="background:yellow; color:green"
|-
| abc || def || ghi
|- style="background:red; color:white"
| jkl || mno || pqr
|-
| stu || style="background:silver" | vwx || yz
|}
</blockquote>

To make the table blend in with the background, use <code>style="background:none"</code>. (Warning: <code>style="background:inherit"</code>, does not work with some browsers, including IE6!)

===Width, height===
The width and height of the whole table can be specified, as well as the height of a row. To specify the width of a column one can specify the width of an arbitrary cell in it. If the width is not specified for all columns, and/or the height is not specified for all rows, then there is some ambiguity, and the result depends on the browser.

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| style="width:75%; height:200px" border="1"
|-
| abc || def || ghi
|- style="height:100px"
| jkl || style="width:200px" |mno || pqr
|-
| stu || vwx || yz
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| style="width:75%; height:200px" border="1"
|-
| abc || def || ghi
|- style="height:100px"
| jkl || style="width:200px" |mno || pqr
|-
| stu || vwx || yz
|}
</blockquote>

Note that <code>style="</code>inline CSS<code>"</code> has no effect with some browsers. If it's important equivalent older constructs like <code>width="75%"</code> should work on more browsers.

====Setting your column widths====
If you wish to force column widths to your own requirements, rather than accepting the width of the widest text element in a column's cells, then follow this example. Note that wrap-around of text is forced.

<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid black; padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| border="1" cellpadding="2"
!width="50"|Name
!width="225"|Effect
!width="225"|Games Found In
|-
|Pokeball || Regular Pokeball || All Versions
|-
|Great Ball || Better than a Pokeball || All Versions
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid black; padding: 1em;">
{| border="1" cellpadding="2"
!width="50"|Name
!width="225"|Effect
!width="225"|Games Found In
|-
|Pokeball || Regular Pokeball || All Versions
|-
|Great Ball || Better than a Pokeball || All Versions
|}
</blockquote>

===Positioning===
One can position the table itself, and all contents in a row, and contents in a cell, but not with a single parameter all contents in the table, see [[m:Template talk:Table demo]]. Do not, under any circumstances, use "float" to position a table. It will break page rendering at large font sizes.

===Mélange===
Here's a more advanced example, showing some more options available for making up tables. You can play with these settings in your own table to see what effect they have. Not all of these techniques may be appropriate in all cases; just because you can add colored backgrounds, for example, doesn't mean it's always a good idea. Try to keep the markup in your tables relatively simple -- remember, other people are going to be editing the article too! This example should give you an idea of what is possible, though.

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0" align="center"
|+'''An example table'''
|-
! style="background:#efefef;" | First header
! colspan="2" style="background:#ffdead;" | Second header
|-
| upper left
|  
| rowspan=2 style="border-bottom:3px solid grey;" valign="top" |
right side
|-
| style="border-bottom:3px solid grey;" | lower left
| style="border-bottom:3px solid grey;" | lower middle
|-
| colspan="3" align="center" |
{| border="0"
|+''A table in a table''
|-
| align="center" width="150px" | [[Image:wiki.png]]
| align="center" width="150px" | [[Image:wiki.png]]
|-
| align="center" colspan="2" style="border-top:1px solid red; border-right:1px
solid red; border-bottom:2px solid red; border-left:1px solid red;" |
Two Wikimedia logos
|}
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| border="1" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="0" align="center"
|+'''An example table'''
|-
! style="background:#efefef;" | First header
! colspan="2" style="background:#ffdead;" | Second header
|-
| upper left
|  
| rowspan=2 style="border-bottom:3px solid grey;" valign="top" |
right side
|-
| style="border-bottom:3px solid grey;" | lower left
| style="border-bottom:3px solid grey;" | lower middle
|-
| colspan="3" align="center" |
{| border="0"
|+''A table in a table''
|-
| align="center" width="150px" | [[Image:wiki.png]]
| align="center" width="150px" | [[Image:wiki.png]]
|-
| align="center" colspan="2" style="border-top:1px solid red; border-right:1px solid red; border-bottom:2px solid red; border-left:1px solid red;" |
Two Wikimedia logos
|}
|}
</blockquote>

=== Floating table ===
'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
This paragraph is before the table. Lorem ipsum dolor sit
amet, consectetur adipisicing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor
incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad
minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation...

{| align="right" border="1"
| Col 1, row 1
|rowspan="2"| Col 2, row 1 (and 2)
| Col 3, row 1
|-
| Col 1, row 2
| Col 3, row 2
|}

Note the floating table to the right.

This paragraph is after the table. Lorem ipsum dolor sit
amet, consectetur adipisicing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor
incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad
minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation...
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">

This paragraph is before the table. Lorem ipsum dolor sit
amet, consectetur adipisicing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor
incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad
minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation...

{| align="right" border="1"
| Col 1, row 1
|rowspan="2"| Col 2, row 1 (and 2)
| Col 3, row 1
|-
| Col 1, row 2
| Col 3, row 2
|}

Note the floating table to the right.

This paragraph is after the table. Lorem ipsum dolor sit
amet, consectetur adipisicing elit, sed do eiusmod tempor
incididunt ut labore et dolore magna aliqua. Ut enim ad
minim veniam, quis nostrud exercitation...
</blockquote>{{-}}

=== Nested tables ===
This shows one table (in blue) nested inside another table's cell2. ''Nested tables have to start on a new line.''

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><p style="border: 1px dashed #2f6fab; background-color: #f9f9f9;"><tt>
<nowiki>{|</nowiki> border="1"<br />
| &alpha;<br />
| align="center" | cell2<br />
<span style="color: navy;">
'''<nowiki>{|</nowiki> border="2" style="background-color:#ABCDEF;"'''<br />
'''| NESTED'''<br />
'''|-'''<br />
'''| TABLE'''<br />
'''<nowiki>|}</nowiki>'''<br />
</span>
| valign="bottom" | the original table again<br />
<nowiki>|}</nowiki>
</tt></p></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| border="1"
| α
| align="center" | cell2
{| border="2" style="background-color:#ABCDEF;"
| NESTED
|-
| TABLE
|}
| valign="bottom" | the original table again
|}
</blockquote>

===Combined use of COLSPAN and ROWSPAN===

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0"
|-
! Column 1 || Column 2 || Column 3
|-
| rowspan="2"| A
| colspan="2" align="center"| B
|-
| C 
| D
|-
| E
| rowspan="2" colspan="2" align="center"| F
|-
| G 
|-
| colspan="3" align="center"| H
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| border="1" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="0"
|-
! Column 1 || Column 2 || Column 3
|-
| rowspan="2"| A
| colspan="2" align="center"| B
|-
| C 
| D
|-
| E
| rowspan="2" colspan="2" align="center"| F
|-
| G 
|-
| colspan="3" align="center"| H
|}
</blockquote>

Note that using <code>rowspan="2"</code> for cell '''G''' combined with <code>rowspan="3"</code> for cell '''F''' to get another row below '''G''' and '''F''' won't work, because all (implicit) cells would be empty.
Likewise complete columns are not displayed if all their cells are empty. Borders between non-empty and empty cells might be also not displayed (depending on the browser), use <code>&nbsp;</code> to fill an empty cell with dummy content.

===Centering tables===
Centered tables can be achieved, but they will not "float"; that is to say, no text will appear to either side. The trick is <tt><nowiki>{| style="margin: 1em auto 1em auto"</nowiki></tt>

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| class="wikitable" style="margin: 1em auto 1em auto"
|+ '''Cells left-aligned, table centered'''
! Duis || aute || irure
|-
| dolor || in reprehenderit || in voluptate velit
|-
| esse cillum dolore || eu fugiat nulla || pariatur.
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| class="wikitable" style="margin: 1em auto 1em auto"
|+ '''Cells left-aligned, table centered'''
! Duis || aute || irure
|-
| dolor || in reprehenderit || in voluptate velit
|-
| esse cillum dolore || eu fugiat nulla || pariatur.
|}
</blockquote>

===Setting parameters===

At the start of a cell, add your parameter followed by a single pipe. For example <tt>width="300"|</tt> will set that cell to a width of 300 pixels. To set more than one parameter, leave a space between each one.

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{|
|-
| bgcolor="red"|cell1 || width="300" bgcolor="blue"|cell2 || bgcolor="green"|cell3
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{|
|-
| bgcolor="red"|cell1 || width="300" bgcolor="blue"|cell2 || bgcolor="green"|cell3
|}
</blockquote>

===Decimal point alignment===

A method to get columns of numbers aligned at the decimal point is as follows:

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"
|align="right"| 432 || .1
|-
|align="right"| 43 || .21
|-
|align="right"| 4 || .321
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"
|align="right"| 432 || .1
|-
|align="right"| 43 || .21
|-
|align="right"| 4 || .321
|}
</blockquote>

If the column of numbers appears in a table with cell padding or cell spacing, one can still align the decimal points without an unsightly gap in the middle. Embed a table in each number's cell and specify its column widths. Make the embedded tables' column widths the same for each cell in the column. (If decimal points are still misaligned using this method, the main table's column may be too narrow. Add a parameter to increase the column's width.)

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{|border="1" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="2"
|
{|cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"
|align="right" width="50%"| 432 ||width="50%"| .1
|}
|-
|
{|cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"
|align="right" width="50%"| 43 ||width="50%"| .21
|}
|-
|
{|cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"
|align="right" width="50%"| 4 ||width="50%"| .321
|}
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{|border="1" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="2"
|
{|cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"
|align="right" width="50%"| 432 ||width="50%"| .1
|}
|-
|
{|cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"
|align="right" width="50%"| 43 ||width="50%"| .21
|}
|-
|
{|cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"
|align="right" width="50%"| 4 ||width="50%"| .321
|}
|}
</blockquote>

In simple cases one can dispense with the table feature and simply start the lines with a space, and put spaces to position the numbers:

432.1
43.21
4.321

==Style classes==

Some users have created [[w:CSS|CSS]] classes and [[Help:templates|templates]] to make table styles easier. Instead of remembering table parameters, you just include an appropriate style class after the <code>{|</code>. This helps keep table formatting consistent, and can allow a single change to the class to fix a problem or enhance the look of all the tables that are using it at once. For instance, this:

<table border="0" align="center"><tr><td width="46%">
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| border="1" cellpadding="2"
|+Multiplication table
|-
! &times; !! 1 !! 2 !! 3
|-
! 1
| 1 || 2 || 3
|-
! 2
| 2 || 4 || 6
|-
! 3
| 3 || 6 || 9
|-
! 4
| 4 || 8 || 12
|-
! 5
| 5 || 10 || 15
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>
</td><td> </td><td width="48%">
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| border="1" cellpadding="2"
|+Multiplication table
|-
! × !! 1 !! 2 !! 3
|-
! 1
| 1 || 2 || 3
|-
! 2
| 2 || 4 || 6
|-
! 3
| 3 || 6 || 9
|-
! 4
| 4 || 8 || 12
|-
! 5
| 5 || 10 || 15
|}
</blockquote></td></tr><tr>
<td colspan="3" align="center">becomes this:</td></tr>
<tr><td width="46%">
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| class="wikitable"
|+Multiplication table
|-
! &times; !! 1 !! 2 !! 3
|-
! 1
| 1 || 2 || 3
|-
! 2
| 2 || 4 || 6
|-
! 3
| 3 || 6 || 9
|-
! 4
| 4 || 8 || 12
|-
! 5
| 5 || 10 || 15
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>
</td><td> </td><td width="48%">
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| class="wikitable"
|+Multiplication table
|-
! × !! 1 !! 2 !! 3
|-
! 1
| 1 || 2 || 3
|-
! 2
| 2 || 4 || 6
|-
! 3
| 3 || 6 || 9
|-
! 4
| 4 || 8 || 12
|-
! 5
| 5 || 10 || 15
|}
</blockquote></td></tr></table>

simply by replacing inline CSS for the table by <code>class="wikitable"</code>. This is because the ''wikitable'' class in [[MediaWiki:Common.css]] contains a number of ''table.wikitable'' [[w:CSS|CSS]] style rules. These are all applied at once when you mark a table with the class. You can then add additional style rules if desired. These override the class's rules, allowing you to use the class style as a base and build up on it:

'''Wiki markup'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;"><pre><nowiki>
{| class="wikitable" style="font-style:italic; font-size:120%; border:3px dashed red;"
|+Multiplication table
|-
! &times; !! 1 !! 2 !! 3
|-
! 1
| 1 || 2 || 3
|-
! 2
| 2 || 4 || 6
|-
! 3
| 3 || 6 || 9
|-
! 4
| 4 || 8 || 12
|-
! 5
| 5 || 10 || 15
|}
</nowiki></pre></blockquote>

'''What it looks like in your browser'''
<blockquote style="background: white; border: 1px solid rgb(153, 153, 153); padding: 1em;">
{| class="wikitable" style="font-style:italic; font-size:120%; border:3px dashed red;"
|+Multiplication table
|-
! × !! 1 !! 2 !! 3
|-
! 1
| 1 || 2 || 3
|-
! 2
| 2 || 4 || 6
|-
! 3
| 3 || 6 || 9
|-
! 4
| 4 || 8 || 12
|-
! 5
| 5 || 10 || 15
|}
</blockquote>

Notice that the table retains the gray background of the wikitable class, and the headers are still bold and centered. But now the text formatting has been overridden by the local ''style'' statement; all of the text in the table has been made italic and 120% normal size, and the wikitable border has been replaced by the red dashed border.

Of course this works only for browsers supporting inline CSS, if it's important use XHTML markup like <code><big></code> instead of "font-size:120%", or Wiki markup like <code><nowiki>''text''</nowiki></code> instead of "font-style:italic".

==Other table syntax==
Other types of '''table''' syntax that MediaWiki supports:
#XHTML
#HTML and wiki <nowiki><td></nowiki> syntax ('''Do not use''')

All three are supported by MediaWiki and create (currently) valid HTML output, but the pipe syntax is the simplest, especially for people who are already familiar with HTML. Also, HTML and wiki <nowiki><td></nowiki> syntax will not necessarily remain browser-supported in the upcoming future, especially on handheld internet-accessible devices.

See also [[w:Table (HTML)|Table (HTML)]], [[w:HTML element#Tables|HTML element#Tables]]. Note however that the <code>thead</code>, <code>tbody</code>, <code>tfoot</code>, <code>colgroup</code>, and <code>col</code> elements are currently not [[Help:HTML in wikitext#Permitted_HTML|supported in MediaWiki]].

===Comparison of table syntax===
<table class="wikitable">
<tr><th> <th>XHTML <th>HTML & Wiki-td <th>Wiki-pipe

<tr>
<th>Table
<td><nowiki><table></table></nowiki>
<td><nowiki><table></table></nowiki>
<td><pre><nowiki>{| params
|}</nowiki></pre>

<tr>
<th>Caption
<td><nowiki><caption></caption></nowiki>
<td><nowiki><caption></caption></nowiki>
<td><pre><nowiki>|+ caption</nowiki></pre>

<tr>
<th>Row
<td><nowiki><tr></tr></nowiki>
<td><nowiki><tr></nowiki>
<td><pre><nowiki>|- params </nowiki></pre>

<tr>
<th>Data cell

<td>
<nowiki><td>cell1</td></nowiki><br>
<nowiki><td>cell2</td></nowiki>

<td>
<nowiki><td>cell1</nowiki><br>
<nowiki><td>cell2</nowiki>

<td>
<pre><nowiki>| cell1
| cell2</nowiki></pre>

<tr>
<th>Data cell
<td><nowiki><td>cell1</td> <td>cell2</td> <td>cell3</td></nowiki>
<td><nowiki><td>cell1 <td>cell2 <td>cell3</nowiki>
<td><pre><nowiki>|cell1||cell2||cell3</nowiki></pre>

<tr>
<th>Header cell
<td><nowiki><th></th></nowiki>
<td><nowiki><th></nowiki>
<td><pre><nowiki>! heading</nowiki></pre>

<tr>
<th rowspan="2">Sample table
<td colspan="3">
<table align="center" border="1" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="3">
<tr>
<td>1</td>
<td>2</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>3</td>
<td>4</td>
</tr>
</table>

<tr>
<td><pre><nowiki>
<table>
<tr>
<td>1</td>
<td>2</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>3</td>
<td>4</td>
</tr>
</table>
</nowiki></pre>

<td><pre><nowiki>
<table>
<tr>
<td> 1 <td> 2
<tr>
<td> 3 <td> 4
</table>
</nowiki></pre>

<td><pre><nowiki>
{|
| 1 || 2
|-
| 3 || 4
|}</nowiki></pre>

<tr>
<th rowspan="2">Sample table
<td colspan="3">
<table align="center" border="1" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="3">
<tr>
<td>1</td>
<td>2</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>3</td>
<td>4</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>5</td>
<td>6</td>
</tr>
</table>

<tr>
<td><pre><nowiki>
<table>
<tr>
<td>1</td>
<td>2</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>3</td>
<td>4</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>5</td>
<td>6</td>
</tr>
</table>
</nowiki></pre>

<td><pre><nowiki>
<table>
<tr>
<td> 1 <td> 2
<tr>
<td> 3 <td> 4
<tr>
<td> 5 <td> 6
</table>
</nowiki></pre>

<td><pre><nowiki>
{|
| 1 || 2
|-
| 3 || 4
|-
| 5 || 6
|}</nowiki></pre>

<tr>
<th>Pros
<td valign="top">
* Can be previewed/debugged with any XHTML editor
* Can be formatted for easier reading
* Well-known

<td valign="top">
* Can be previewed/debugged with any HTML editor
* Can be formatted for easier reading
* Well-known
* Takes less space than XHTML
<td valign="top">
* Easy to write
* Easy to read
* Takes little space

<tr>
<th>Cons
<td valign="top">
* Tedious
* Takes a lot of space
* Difficult to read quickly

<td valign="top">
* Should not be used
* Confusing, especially for people with little HTML experience
* Poorly formed
* Poorly delimited
* Generally odd looking
* May not have browser support in future

<td valign="top">
* Unfamiliar syntax
* Rigid structure
* Cannot be indented
* Text (as in HTML tags) may be easier for some people to read than series of pipes, plus signs, exclamation marks, etc.
* Is nothing more than a shortcut for HTML-style tags. Not easily understood by those unfamiliar with HTML table concepts

<tr><th> <th>XHTML <th>HTML & Wiki-td <th>Wiki-pipe
</table>

==Pipe syntax in terms of the HTML produced==
The pipe syntax, developed by [[m:User: Magnus Manske| Magnus Manske]], substitutes pipes (<nowiki>|</nowiki>) for HTML. There is an [http://www.uni-bonn.de/~manfear/html2wiki-tables.php on-line script] which converts html tables to pipe syntax tables.

The pipes must start at the beginning of a new line, except when separating parameters from content or when using <code>||</code> to separate cells on a single line. The parameters are optional.

===Tables===
A [[w:Table (HTML)|table]] is defined by
<nowiki>
{| ''params''
|}
</nowiki>
which equals
<nowiki>
<table ''params''>Insert non-formatted text here
</table>
</nowiki>

:''Careful'': You '''must include''' the '''space''' between <code>'''{|'''</code> and <code>''params''</code>, or the first parameter gets ignored.

===Rows===
<tr> tags will be generated automatically for the first row. To start a new row, use
|-
which results in
<tr>
Parameters can be added like this:
|- ''params''
which results in
<tr ''params''>

Note:
* <tr> tags will be automatically opened at the first <td> equivalent
* <tr> tags will be automatically closed at <tr> and </table> equivalents

===Cells===
Cells are generated either like this:
|cell1
|cell2
|cell3
or like this:
|cell1||cell2||cell3
which both equal
<td>cell1</td><td>cell2</td><td>cell3</td>
so "||" equals "newline" + "|"

Parameters in cells can be used like this:
|''params''|cell1||''params''|cell2||''params''|cell3
which will result in
<td ''params''>cell1</td>
<td ''params''>cell2</td>
<td ''params''>cell3</td>

===Headers===
Functions the same way as TD, except "!" is used instead of the opening "|". "!!" can be used instead of "||". Parameters still use "|", though! Example:
<nowiki>!</nowiki>''params''|cell1

===[[Help:Table Caption|Captions]]===

A <caption> tag is created by
|+ Caption
which generates
<caption>Caption</caption>
You can also use parameters:
|+ ''params''|Caption
which will generate
<caption ''params''>Caption</caption>

== Displaying the table code which generates a table ==

A simple wiki markup table codes inside a ''Code box'' can be seen below.

<pre>
{| border="5" cellspacing="5" cellpadding="2"
| style="text-align: center;" | [[Image:gnome-system.png]]
|-
! Computer
|-
| Processor Speed: 1.8 GHz
|}
</pre>

Above codes produces / displays below table:

{| border="5" cellspacing="5" cellpadding="2" style="background-color: transparent;"
| style="text-align: center;" | [[Image:gnome-system.png]]
|-
! Computer
|-
| Processor Speed: 1.8 GHz
|}

Below codes, generated and displayed the above table's ''Code box'' code itself, on the screen and web page, inside a blue colored dashed bordered rectangular box.

{| border="0" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="0" style="background-color: transparent;"
| width="10%" |  
|<pre>
<pre>
{| border="5" cellspacing="5" cellpadding="2"
| style="text-align: center;" | [[Image:gnome-system.png]]
|-
! Computer
|-
| Processor Speed: 1.8 GHz
|}
</pre>
</pre>
| width="10%" |  
|}

Note that, HTML tag '''<tt><pre></tt>''' was used to achieve displaying the above codes and the ''Code box''.

=== Other alternatives to display table code ===

In most cases, when a code line is longer than the web browser window's width, then a scrolling bar appears at bottom, to let the viewer slide to the right side (and also left side) to see the rest of the codes, because, the use of <tt><pre></tt> tag causes to keep the code line intact, unless a [[w:End-of-line|EOL]] ([[w:Carriage return|CR]]/[[w:Line feed|LF]]) hidden character is reached in that text line. But having to slide or scroll to the right or left for viewing the full codes is often not comfortable to many ones. To solve such problem, using the '''<tt><p></tt>''', '''<tt><tt></tt>''' and '''<tt><br /></tt>''' HTML tags, are better than using the '''<tt><pre></tt>''' tag, as those will not result in moving the scroll-bar right (or left) side for viewing, by keeping all the codes to the same width as the web browser window's width. By placing the codes inside the <tt><tt>...</tt></tt> HTML tags, codes are displayed with a [[w:Non-proportional font|fixed width]] text/font, (like the <tt><pre></tt> tag uses) for easier reading. HTML tag <tt><br /></tt> is used to display (or bring) next line of codes, starting from the next line. HTML tag <tt><p></tt> along with its CSS style properties, is used to create the blue colored dashed bordered rectangular box ('''''Code box''''') around the codes, (like the HTML <tt><pre></tt> tag, which gets these properties from the [http://en.wikipedia.org/style/monobook/main.css main.css] stylesheet file).

An example of table code with a long line is:

<p style="padding: 1em; border: 1px dashed #2f6fab; color: Black; background-color: #f9f9f9; line-height: 1.1em;"> <tt>
{| border="5" cellspacing="5" cellpadding="2" <br />
| style="text-align: center;" | [[Image:gnome-system.png]] <br />
|- <br />
! Computer <br />
|- <br />
| style="color: yellow; background-color: green;" | Processor Speed: <span style="color: white;"> 1.8 GHz </span>''' <br />
|}
</tt> </p>

producing the below table:

{| border="5" cellspacing="5" cellpadding="2"
| style="text-align: center;" | [[Image:gnome-system.png]]
|-
! Computer
|-
| style="color: yellow; background-color: green;" | Processor Speed: <span style="color: white;"> 1.8 GHz </span>
|}

''Code box'' above the table has the auto line wrapping feature enabled. Note the long line (the sixth line from top) inside the codes, which is wrapped inside the ''Code box''. This ''Code box'' and the codes, can be displayed by using below codes in the edit box.

<p style="padding: 1em; border: 1px dashed #2f6fab; color: Black; background-color: #f9f9f9; line-height: 1.1em;"> <tt>
<p style="padding: 1em; border: 1px dashed #2f6fab; color: Black; background-color: #f9f9f9; line-height: 1.1em;"> <tt> <br />
<nowiki><nowiki>{|</nowiki></nowiki> border="5" cellspacing="5" cellpadding="2" <br /> <br />
| style="text-align: center;" | '''<nowiki>'''<nowiki>[[</nowiki>'''</nowiki>'''Image:gnome-system.png]] <br /> <br />
|- <br /> <br />
! Computer <br /> <br />
|- <br /> <br />
'''| style="color: yellow; background-color: green;" | Processor Speed: <nowiki><nowiki><span style="color: white;"></nowiki></nowiki> 1.8 GHz <nowiki><nowiki></span></nowiki></nowiki> <br />''' <br />
<nowiki><nowiki>|}</nowiki></nowiki> <br /> <br />
</tt> </p>
</tt></p>

See the above codes, note that, <tt><nowiki></tt>...<tt></nowiki></tt> tags were used to disable wiki markup codes for beginning a table ('''{|'''), ending a table ('''|}'''), start of an image displaying ('''[['''), or a hyperlink, etc. All wiki & HTML markup codes need to be disabled by enclosing them inside the <tt><nowiki></tt>...<tt></nowiki></tt> tags. If these codes were to be displayed inside another table, then, each '''|''' (pipe) & '''!''' (Exclamation mark) symbol also needed to be enclosed inside the <tt><nowiki></tt> tags. Note that, the longer line is automatically wrapped according to the width of the web browser's window, inside the ''Code box''.

Alternatively, we can replace each '''|''' ([[w:Vertical bar|pipe symbol]]) character with <tt>'''&#124;'''</tt> (HTML decimal entity code), replace each '''!''' ([[w:Exclamation mark|exclamation mark]]) with <tt>'''&#33;'''</tt> code, replace '''{''' (beginning curly/second [[w:Bracket|bracket]]) with <tt>'''&#123;'''</tt> and we may replace '''}''' (closing curly/second bracket) with <tt>'''&#125;'''</tt> code. Also replace the '''<''' (less than sign, or beginning angle bracket) with <tt>'''&#60;'''</tt> numeric entity code or, replace it with <tt>'''&lt;'''</tt> (HTML symbol entity code). For more on HTML decimal or [[w:Hexadecimal|hexadecimal]] numeric entity codes, please see [[w:Windows Alt codes]]. To display the wiki image markup code, we should replace the '''[''' (beginning square/third bracket) with <tt>'''&#91;'''</tt> and we may replace ''']''' (closing square/third bracket) with <tt>'''&#93;'''</tt>. When we are replacing characters with their numeric enitity codes, we are actually disabling their normal functionality, so we can display them on the web page(s).

{| border="0" width="100%"
| By using the numeric entity codes, mentioned in above paragraph, below codes can display the above ''Code box'' in another '''alternative (better)''' way. Note that, the ''longer line'' is automatically wrapped, without exceeding the browser window's width, inside the below ''Code box''.
|   
| width="33%" |
<center>
{| border="5" cellspacing="5" cellpadding="2"
| style="text-align: center;" | [[Image:gnome-system.png]]
|-
! Computer
|-
| style="color: yellow; background-color: green;" | Processor Speed: <span style="color: white;"> 1.8 GHz </span>
|}
</center>
|}

<p style="padding: 1em; border: 1px dashed #2f6fab; color: Black; background-color: #f9f9f9; line-height: 1.1em;"> <tt>
<p style="padding: 1em; border: 1px dashed #2f6fab; color: Black; background-color: #f9f9f9; line-height: 1.1em;"> <tt> <br />
&#123;&#124; border="5" cellspacing="5" cellpadding="2" <br /> <br />
&#124; style="text-align: center;" &#124; &#91;&#91;Image:gnome-system.png]] <br /> <br />
&#124;- <br /> <br />
&#33; Computer <br /> <br />
&#124;- <br /> <br />
'''&#124; style="color: yellow; background-color: green;" &#124; Processor Speed: &#60;span style="color: red;"> 1.8 GHz &#60;/span> <br />''' <br />
&#124;&#125; <br /> <br />
</tt> </p>
</tt> </p>

See also [[Help:Advanced_editing#Disabling_wikitext_interpretation_and.2For_reformatting|disabling wikitext interpretation and/or reformatting]].

==See also==
*[[m:simplified table syntax]]
*[[m:wiki markup tables]]
*[[w:en:User:Dcljr/Tables]]
*[[w:Table (HTML)]]
*examples:
**[[w:en:Template talk:Chess position|Chess board]]
**[[w:en:Template talk:Game of Go Position|Go board]]
**[[w:en:Monopoly (game)#Board|Monopoly board]]
**[[m:Template talk:Square 8x8 pentomino example|Square 8x8 pentomino example]]

==External links==
*[[:de:Wikipedia:Helferlein/EXCEL Tabellenumwandlung|VBA-Macro for EXCEL tableconversion]] published in German-Wikipediaproject (english instructions included)
*[http://www.cnic.org/html2mediawiki.html HTML tables to wiki converter at cnic.org]
*[http://area23.brightbyte.de/csv2wp.php csv2wp] - converts [[w:comma-separated values|comma-separated values]] (CSV) format to pipe syntax. You may use this to import tables from Excel etc. ([[wikipedia:de:Benutzer:Duesentrieb/csv2wp|more information]])
*[http://www.uni-bonn.de/~manfear/html2wiki-tables.php HTML tables to wiki converter at uni-bonn.de]
*[http://diberri.dyndns.org/html2wiki.html HTML tables to wiki converter at diberri.dyndns.org]
*[http://pywikipediabot.sourceforge.net/ pywikipediabot] (can convert HTML tables to wiki)

{{h:f|enname=Table}}

Help:Table

2006-07-23T20:25:30Z

MikeClark:

Until we have our own Editing Help page, here's a ling to Wikpedia's (opens in a new browser window):

* <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Editing" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Editing</a>

Talk:Quote mining examples

2006-07-23T18:19:33Z

MikeClark:

I guess I have to take a little exception to the premise here: "...Or that education, book reading, and scholarship were higher in Palmyra than London? Can anyone take this assertion seriously?" My understanding of the literacy rate in the United States in comparison to the literacy rate in England, at this time in history, is that the vast majority of white Americans were literate, while in England this was nowhere near the case. Before printers became more common in English America, a large part of the trade between England and America was, in fact, books. The notion that there was a larger proportion of people in Palmyra who not only read, but also owned books, than in London, is not at all unlikely. Of course, the sheer number of book-owning people in London definitely exceeded the population of Palmyra and its surrounds, but as to literacy rate Palmyra would have had London beat all around. It is always a mistake to simply assume that because something might be true today that it was true a hundred and fifty years ago. And consider that in little Podunk Palmyra there was a printer who could print major books! That was the case because there was a ''local market'' for the product of E. B. Grandin's press; Palmyra was not full of ignorant, unlettered, country bumpkins. Well, maybe there were a lot of country bumpkins, but in contrast to Mother England at the time, almost all ''our'' country bumpkins could read. [[User:MikeClark|Mike Clark]] 14:50, 6 Nov 2005 (EST)

Does anyone actually read these Talk pages? No response to the above. Hmmm. Completely changing the topic to a little problem with </table> tags appearing in the article. I copied the text where this is occurring over to an html editor and it turns out that the html tables are correctly formed, so that is not the problem. I think the problem rests with how MediaWiki handles embedded html. It would probably be best for us to start using MediaWiki table notation instead of trying to embed html tables. [[User:MikeClark|Mike Clark]] 12:19, 23 Jul 2006 (MDT)

Template:Book of Mormon anachronisms

2006-06-28T03:26:41Z

MikeClark:

:<small>[http://www.fairwiki.org/index.php?title=Template:Book_of_Mormon_anachronisms&action=edit edit this list]</small>
*[[Book_of_Mormon_anachronisms |Anachronisms (general page)]]
*[[%22Adieu%22_in_the_Book_of_Mormon|"Adieu"]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Animals|Animals]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Cement|Cement]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Coins|Coins]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Compass|Compass]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Gadianton_masons|Gadianton Robbers as Masons?]]
*[[Book of Mormon geography|Geography]]{{nw}}
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Holy Ghost|Holy Ghost]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Jerusalem_vs_Bethlehem|Jerusalem as site of Jesus' birth]]
*[[Legal codes in Book of Mormon| Legal codes and concepts]]{{nw}}
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Metals|Metals]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Names|Names]]{{nw}}
*[[Olive culture in the Book of Mormon|Olive culture]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Plants|Plants]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Red sea versus reed sea| Red Sea vs Reed Sea]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Reformed Egyptian|Reformed Egyptian]]
*[[Satyrs_in_the_Book_of_Mormon|Satyrs]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Shiz struggles to breathe|Shiz struggles to breathe]]
*[[Sweat and skin pores]]
*[[Snow in the Book of Mormon|Snow]]
*[[Book of Mormon anachronisms:Temple in New World|Temple in the New World]]{{nw}}
*[[Book of Mormon and warfare|Warfare]]

User:MikeClark

2006-06-25T21:50:18Z

MikeClark:

I am Mike Clark (imagine that), and am just playing around for the moment. Here's a mission photograph with my father on the right and me on the left. In the Salt Lake Airport in 1972.

[[Image:MikeClarkMissionPhoto.jpg]]

User:MikeClark

2006-06-24T05:09:15Z

MikeClark:

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-10T06:17:40Z

MikeClark: /* Printed material */

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-10T06:10:31Z

MikeClark: /* Printed material */

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-10T05:51:29Z

MikeClark: /* Criticism */

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-10T05:50:35Z

MikeClark: /* Source(s) of the Criticism */

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-10T05:48:57Z

MikeClark: /* Criticism */

{{draft}}
==Criticism==
Many of the Church's critics like to claim that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not Christian. This criticism, or ''exclusion'', takes many forms. These include:

*Mormons [[Worship_different_Jesus |worship a different Christ]] than the Christ of the Bible

===Source(s) of the Criticism===
*Hank Hanegraaff, [[CRI]], MORMONS — CAN THEY BE CONSIDERED CHRISTIANS?[http://www.equip.org/free/CP0300.htm *]

:Better known as Mormons, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints now numbers over 9 million members in almost 130 territories around the globe. Are they really the true followers of Jesus Christ as they claim to be?

:To quote one Mormon apologist: “Latter-day Saints are Christians because they emphatically believe in Christ, use His name in their official church title, and believe in the Bible and the Book of Mormon which testify repeatedly of the reality of Christ and the truth of His teachings.” Jesus Christ, no doubt, plays a central role in Mormon theology. However, Paul warns that to be a Christian, one must believe in the true Christ—the Jesus of the Bible—and not another Jesus. In fact, we would all agree with the late Mormon apostle Bruce R. McConkie when he says, “it matters not that people simply say they believe in Christ, or think they are followers of Moses, or the Apostles. What counts is the reality.” And the reality is that Mormons believe in a Jesus vastly different than the Jesus of the Bible.

:You see, Mormonism teaches that Jesus is just one of countless other gods—a belief known as polytheism. Now, a Mormon may try to deny being a polytheist by affirming the existence of other gods, while in the same breath worshipping only God the Father. However, don’t forget Christ’s proclamation in Mark chapter 12—that God’s most important commandment is to recognize that there is only one God and only one Lord.

:Where does this leave Jesus in Mormon Theology? Well, Mormons say they believe that Jesus is Jehovah, the LORD, the God of Israel, yet they refuse to pray to Him, as Jehovah Himself commands in the Old Testament (cf. Deut. 4:7; 2 Chron. 7:14; Pss. 5:2; 32:6; Jer. 29:7,12)—the same Jehovah who knows of no other God besides Himself, the One worshipped and honored by all true Christians (Ex. 34:14; cf. Matt. 2:11; 14:33; Luke 24:52). And so, judging by its own teachings, Mormonism cannot be rightly considered Christian.

:On Mormonism, that’s the CRI Perspective. I’m Hank Hanegraaff.

==Response==
While acknowledging that Jesus Christ plays a central role in LDS theology, this is downplayed by the insistence that "our" Jesus is not the same as the Jesus found in the Bible.

==Conclusion==

A summary of the argument against the criticism.

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
*[[Christian Research Institute]] or [[CRI]]

===FAIR web site===

* Cooper Johnson, [http://www.fairlds.org/apol/antis/200205.html Mormons--Can They Be Considered Christians?], FAIR Article.

===External links===
*

===Printed material===
*Printed resources whose text is not available online

Talk:Quote mining examples

2005-11-06T19:50:32Z

MikeClark:

Joseph Smith/Polygamy/Marriages to young women

2005-11-06T19:20:33Z

MikeClark: /* Historical and cultural perspective */

{{draft}}
==Criticism==
Critics argue that Joseph Smith's polygamous marriages to young women are evidence that he was immoral, perhaps even a pedophile.

==Response==
The information we have on Joseph Smith's plural marriages is sketchy, simply because there were few official records kept at the time because of the fear of misunderstanding and persecution. What we do know is culled from journals and reminiscenses of those who were involved.

The most conservative estimates indicate that Joseph entered into plural marriages with 33 women, 6 of whom were under the age of 18. The youngest was Helen Mar Kimball, daughter of LDS apostle Heber C. Kimball, who was 14. The rest were 16 (two) or 17 (three).

===Helen Mar Kimball===

Some people have concluded that Helen did have sexual relations with Joseph, which would have been proper considering that they were married with her consent and the consent of her parents. However, historian Todd Compton does not hold this view; he criticized the anti-Mormons Jerald and Sandra Tanner for using his book to argue for sexual relations, and wrote:

:The Tanners made great mileage out of Joseph Smith's marriage to his youngest wife, Helen Mar Kimball. However, they failed to mention that I wrote that there is absolutely no evidence that there was any sexuality in the marriage, and I suggest that, following later practice in Utah, there may have been no sexuality. (p. 638) All the evidence points to this marriage as a primarily dynastic marriage.{{ref|compton1}}

In other words, polygamous marriages often had other purposes than procreation—one such purpose was likely to tie faithful families together, and this seems to have been a purpose of Joseph's marriage to the daughter of a faithful Apostle. ''(It should be mentioned that many FAIR members do not agree with all of Compton's conclusions from the useful data he collects.)''

Critics who assume that everything "is all about sex" reveal more about themselves than they do about the minds of early Church members.

===Fanny Alger===
Probably the one about whom we know the least is Fanny Alger, Joseph's first plural wife, whom he came to know in early 1833 when she stayed at the Smith home as a house-assistant of sorts to Emma (such work was common for young women at the time). There are no first-hand accounts of their relationship (from Joseph or Fanny), nor are there second-hand accounts (from Emma or Fanny's family). All that we do have is third hand accounts, most of them from many years after the events.

Unfortunately, this lack of reliable and extensive historical detail leaves much room for critics to claim that Joseph Smith had an affair with Fanny and then later invented plural marriage as way to justify his actions. The problem is that we just don't know exactly what happened, and so are left to assume that Joseph acted honorably (as believers) or dishonorably (as critics).

===Historical and cultural perspective===
Plural marriage was certainly not in keeping with the values of "mainstream America" in Joseph Smith's day. However, modern readers also judge the age of the marriage partners by modern standards, rather than the standards of the nineteenth century.

Within Todd Compton's book on Joseph Smith's marriages, he also mentions the following ''monogamous'' marriages:

{| border="1"
|'''Wife'''||'''Wife's Age'''||'''Husband'''||'''Husband's Age'''||'''Difference in age'''
|-
|Lucinda Pendleton ||18||William Morgan||44||26
|-
|Marinda Johnson||19||Orson Hyde||29||10
|-
|Almira McBride||17||Sylvester Stoddard||40s||>23
|-
|Fanny Young||44||Roswell Murray||62||18
|-
|}

The 21st century reader is likely to see marriages of young women to much older men as inappropriate.

According to the law of the early twenty-first century, someone of Joseph Smith's age might be found guilty of "statutory rape" in such a case—this is when an older person (usually a man) has sexual relations with a young person who is too young to give legal "consent." This means that even if she "wants" to have sexual relations, the law considers her too young to give that permission to someone so much older than herself.

But, this is a more modern attitude.

The age of consent under English common law was ''ten''. United States law did not raise the age of consent until the late nineteenth century. In Joseph Smith's day, most states still had declared age of consent to be ten. Some raised it to twelve, and Delaware lowered it to ''seven''!{{ref|georgetown1}}

It is significant that none of Joseph's contemporaries complained about the age differences between polygamous ''or'' monogamous marriage partners. This was simply part of their environment and culture; it is unfair to judge nineteenth cenutry members by twenty-first century social standards.

In past centuries, women would often die in childbirth, and men often remarried younger women afterwards. Women often married older men, because these were more financially established and able to support them than men their own age.

==Conclusion==

==Endnotes==
#{{note|compton1}} Todd M. Compton, Response to Tanners, post to LDS Bookshelf mailing list, no date.

#{{note|georgetown1}} See Melina McTigue, "Statuatory Rape Law Reform in Nineteenth Century Maryland: An Analysis of Theory and Practical Change," (2002), accessed 5 Feb 2005. [http://www.law.georgetown.edu/glh/mctigue.htm *]

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
{{Polygamy_links}}

===FAIR web site===
*FAIR Topical Guide: [http://www.fairlds.org/apol/ai228.html Polyandry]
*FAIR Topical Guide: [http://www.fairlds.org/apol/ai049.html Polygamy]

===Printed material===
{{Polygamy_printed}}

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-05T08:21:20Z

MikeClark: /* Source(s) of the Criticism */

{{draft}}
==Criticism==
Many of the Church's critics like to claim that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not Christian.

===Source(s) of the Criticism===
*Hank Hanegraaff, [[CRI]], MORMONS — CAN THEY BE CONSIDERED CHRISTIANS?[http://www.equip.org/free/CP0300.htm *]

:Better known as Mormons, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints now numbers over 9 million members in almost 130 territories around the globe. Are they really the true followers of Jesus Christ as they claim to be?

:To quote one Mormon apologist: “Latter-day Saints are Christians because they emphatically believe in Christ, use His name in their official church title, and believe in the Bible and the Book of Mormon which testify repeatedly of the reality of Christ and the truth of His teachings.” Jesus Christ, no doubt, plays a central role in Mormon theology. However, Paul warns that to be a Christian, one must believe in the true Christ—the Jesus of the Bible—and not another Jesus. In fact, we would all agree with the late Mormon apostle Bruce R. McConkie when he says, “it matters not that people simply say they believe in Christ, or think they are followers of Moses, or the Apostles. What counts is the reality.” And the reality is that Mormons believe in a Jesus vastly different than the Jesus of the Bible.

:You see, Mormonism teaches that Jesus is just one of countless other gods—a belief known as polytheism. Now, a Mormon may try to deny being a polytheist by affirming the existence of other gods, while in the same breath worshipping only God the Father. However, don’t forget Christ’s proclamation in Mark chapter 12—that God’s most important commandment is to recognize that there is only one God and only one Lord.

:Where does this leave Jesus in Mormon Theology? Well, Mormons say they believe that Jesus is Jehovah, the LORD, the God of Israel, yet they refuse to pray to Him, as Jehovah Himself commands in the Old Testament (cf. Deut. 4:7; 2 Chron. 7:14; Pss. 5:2; 32:6; Jer. 29:7,12)—the same Jehovah who knows of no other God besides Himself, the One worshipped and honored by all true Christians (Ex. 34:14; cf. Matt. 2:11; 14:33; Luke 24:52). And so, judging by its own teachings, Mormonism cannot be rightly considered Christian.

:On Mormonism, that’s the CRI Perspective. I’m Hank Hanegraaff.

==Response==
While acknowledging that Jesus Christ plays a central role in LDS theology, this is downplayed by the insistence that "our" Jesus is not the same as the Jesus found in the Bible.

==Conclusion==

A summary of the argument against the criticism.

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
*[[Christian Research Institute]] or [[CRI]]

===FAIR web site===

* Cooper Johnson, [http://www.fairlds.org/apol/antis/200205.html Mormons--Can They Be Considered Christians?], FAIR Article.

===External links===
*

===Printed material===
*Printed resources whose text is not available online

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-05T08:16:28Z

MikeClark: /* Response */

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-05T08:11:35Z

MikeClark: /* Source(s) of the Criticism */

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-05T08:02:50Z

MikeClark: /* FAIR web site */

{{draft}}
==Criticism==
Many of the Church's critics like to claim that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not Christian.

===Source(s) of the Criticism===
*Hank Hanegraaff, [[CRI]], Is Lucifer the Brother of Jesus[http://www.equip.org/free/CP0300.htm *]

==Response==
The response should be brief and summary in nature.

==Conclusion==

A summary of the argument against the criticism.

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
*[[Christian Research Institute]] or [[CRI]]

===FAIR web site===

* Cooper Johnson, [http://www.fairlds.org/apol/antis/200205.html Mormons--Can They Be Considered Christians?], FAIR Article.

===External links===
*

===Printed material===
*Printed resources whose text is not available online

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-05T08:01:55Z

MikeClark:

{{draft}}
==Criticism==
Many of the Church's critics like to claim that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not Christian.

===Source(s) of the Criticism===
*Hank Hanegraaff, [[CRI]], Is Lucifer the Brother of Jesus[http://www.equip.org/free/CP0300.htm *]

==Response==
The response should be brief and summary in nature.

==Conclusion==

A summary of the argument against the criticism.

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
*[[Christian Research Institute]] or [[CRI]]

===FAIR web site===
*FAIR Topical Guide:
* Cooper Johnson, [http://www.fairlds.org/apol/antis/200205.html Mormons--Can They Be Considered Christians?], FAIR Article.

===External links===
*

===Printed material===
*Printed resources whose text is not available online

Are Mormons Christian

2005-11-05T07:47:59Z

MikeClark:

delete

Specific works/Christopher Marc Nemelka

2005-10-18T02:58:41Z

MikeClark:

{{question}}
==Question==
Mr. Nemelka claims to have been commanded to translate the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon, as well as the lost 116 pages. What can you tell me about this?

==Answer==

===History of Nemelka===

====Biographical dates of interest for Christopher Nemelka====
* 1980 - Nemelka graduates from high school
* Summer 1984 - Nemelka claims that as an employee of LDS Church security, he was in the Salt Lake Temple. He reports there being called as a prophet.
* 1986 - Nemelka divorces from first wife, Paula Blades. They have two children.
* June 1991 - Ex-wife's family gets Nemelka's two children placed under care of Montana's Division of Family services; Nemelka takes one child unlawfully, and is charged with kidnapping. He eventually returns the child, who returns to his mother's custody, and charges are dropped.
* 1993 - Nemelka divorces from second wife, Jackie Stoll. He eventually finishes "the sealed portion," and markets it to some LDS fundamentalist groups. This leads to marriage with two plural wives, who also eventually leave him.
* 1996 - Vicky Prunty, one of the plural wives, cuts ties from from Nemelka.
* Fall 2000 - Nemelka tells LDS member Christine Marie that he is an atheist; they later begin dating, and Nemelka announces that this was only a test. He tells Marie that he is a prophet, called to translate the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon. She eventually gives him at least $5000.
* March 2001 - After visting the home of an ex-wife, Nemelka sentenced to one year in the Salt Lake County jail for violating a restraining order.
* 20 April 2001 - Nemelka reports receiving a revelation in jail instructing him to take a plural wife
* 21 December 2001 - Interview with ''Salt Lake City Weekly'' published, in which he admits to forging the Sealed Portion, lying, and exploiting the religious hopes of others (see quotes below).
* March 2002 - scheduled release from prison for violation of restraining order.
* Mr. Nemelka was also excommunicated on an unspecified date for writing a paper about LDS temple ceremonies.

====Quotes from Nemelka====
* "What I did do was I deceived her [Christine Marie] religiously. I played with her religious beliefs and mind, which I do not think a person should do..." <small>[Salt Lake City weekly, 27 Dec 2001]</small>
* "My whole purpose, though, was to write the sealed portion. Get the sealed portion done. Sell it to the church. My whole idea was to sell it to the LDS church. I was going to sell it to them, because all the Mormons are looking for the sealed portion to come back. I thought I had a good talent for writing. I was going to write it up and sell it to them. They could do with it what they wanted. They probably would have kept it off the market." <small>[''Salt Lake City Weekly'', 27 Dec 2001]</small>
* "I set about in my own mischievous and arrogant way, of which I’m not proud of now, to prove that a person could actually write scripture and present it to people who were looking for certain scripture...I was playing on the belief that LDS people have that one day the gold plates would be returned and the sealed portion would be translated. Basically, I set about to write a fictitious version of the sealed portion as I thought Joseph Smith would have written it had he continued to perpetuate his translation of the gold plates. Much to the chagrin of the LDS church and others, what I wrote was indeed well versed and quite appropriate for the scripture I was trying to portray. Anybody who reads it would just be totally amazed." <small>[''Salt Lake City Weekly'', 27 Dec 2001]</small>
* “My true intent was to somehow perpetuate a religion that would be based on true Christian principals of Christ-like love...Where I made my greatest mistake, for which I’m now extremely sorry for, is that I used deception to perpetuate what I proposed as the truth, assuming at the time that Joseph Smith had done the same thing.” <small>[''Salt Lake City Weekly'', 27 Dec 2001]</small>
* “See, when I did that thing with the fundamentalist group, there were people who wanted to kill me. They were so mad. When I came out and told these other polygamists, fundamentalist guys, that I had really written the sealed portion, that I had done it just to show people that it could be done—they were very upset.” <small>[''Salt Lake City Weekly'', 27 Dec 2001]</small>
* “When I deal with people, I am amazed at the ignorance and stupidity of most. People are so easily manipulated and deceived. Knowing this has made me a near master of manipulation. I try only to use this art, however, to help people. Sometimes the things I do seem terrible at the time, but usually the manipulation works to accomplish that which I intended.” <small>[Letter to wife, dated 2 April 1993, cited in ''Salt Lake City Weekly'', 27 Dec 2001]</small>
* “Yeah that’s, that’s all bull****,” Nemelka said from jail. “All the revelations are bull****, of course. I made ‘em up.” <small>[''Salt Lake City Weekly'', 27 Dec 2001, obcenities present in the original]</small>
* “I’m even glad you’re doing the article, in a way...I am, so that the sealed portion will never go anywhere. There’s a lot to it, a lot more than what you’ve got. In the wrong hands it could really wreak havoc on a Mormon church, which I don’t want to do.” <small>[''Salt Lake City Weekly'', 27 Dec 2001]</small>

====Later Developments====
Since his release from prison, Mr. Nemelka has resumed his prophetic claims and is again insisting that the "sealed portion" is a true prophetic translation. He insists that his confession for the newspaper interview was all a lie to deceive the judge in charge of his case:

:I knew I had to portray something to [Judge] Lindberg that would appease her personal opinion that I thought I was "above her law", and more especially, above the laws of the powerful LDS Church to which she belonged. With her legal power, she could have easily had me confined to a mental institution, if she actual thought I was serious about my calling as the revelator of the sealed portion of the plates of Mormon. I was in her grasp and I wanted out.
:The conclusion I came up with was simple: Lie to Ben Fulton and get him to write something that would impress Lindberg into thinking that I was done with The Sealed Portion and would have nothing further to do with it in the future...Everything I said to [reporter] Ben Fulton of The City Weekly was an attempted manipulation to attempt to ease the mind of Judge Denise Lindberg...>
:<small>— The Sealed Portion Website, Questions, last accessed 5 July 2005. </small>
It would seem that Nemelka has a habit of changing his story repeatedly, lying for his own benefit, and attempting to deceive others.

The remainder of the article demonstrates that his 'translation' work shows the same tendencies.

===The "Book of Lehi"===
As part of his 'prophetic call,' Nemelka produced what he claims is a translation of the lost 116 pages, or "Book of Lehi." This portion of Mormon's abridgement (from Lehi to King Benjamin, roughly) was lost by Martin Harris after the manuscript was loaned to him by Joseph Smith (See [http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/3/1#1 D&C 3], [http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/128/10#10 D&C 10]).

Nemelka's decision to produce the "Book of Lehi" was unwise, since his claims about it can be easily checked against what is known about Joseph Smith's translation of the same material.

====Problems with Length====
There are two extant Book of Mormon manuscripts. The original, dictated by Joseph Smith to his scribes, was probably about 480 pages long; we have fragments from 236 of these pages. A copy was made of the original manuscript—the so-called "printer's manuscript"—and is completely extant save three lines on the first page. This version occupied 464 manuscript pages. Thus, the two manuscript lengths agree within 3-4%.

A computerized count of the original 1830 publication of the Book of Mormon yields 270,745 words. Thus, each original manuscript page would have held about 564 words; the printer's manuscript about 583.

Nemelka's "Book of Lehi" contains 26,709 words when the italicized chapter summaries are excluded. Dividing by 116 pages, we get 230 words per page. The "Book of Lehi" seems, therefore, to contain only about 41% (at best) of the material which one would expect.

Mr. Nemelka includes an introduction to his "translation" of the "Book of Lehi", in which he indicates that

:It depended on the particular writing style of each individual scribe, but generally, there were about 225 words per page that were translated by the prophet and written down by his scribe…
:<small>— The Sealed Portion Website, "Lost 116 Pages," last accessed 5 July 2005.</small>

Unfortunately for his plan to produce the 116 pages, Nemelka has his details wrong. The paper was folded either lengthwise or widthwise before being written on. Both methods were used during the Book of Mormon translation, though widthwise was more common.

:'''Count of lengthwise pages''': Page seven of the manuscript (corresponding to 1 Nephi 4:20-37) contains over 580 words by my count, which matches the estimate of 583 words per page nicely.

:'''Count of widthwise pages''': Alma 45:17-46:6, Helaman 1:5-17, and Alma 42:29-43:10 are all extant widthwise pages from the original manuscript. Word counts in the 1830 edition give values of 523, 526, and 511 respectively, again much closer to the estimate of 583 from the actual Book of Mormon text than Nemelka's claimed 225.

This discrepancy demonstrates that Nemelka is missing at least half of the material that should be present. One might not expect his translation to match Joseph Smith's word-for-word, but the Book of Mormon text produced by Joseph is not so wordy that one could simply eliminate over half of it and retain the same meaning. Mr. Nemelka has underestimated how much material he needed to produce, and so his work is revealed for what it is—an amateurish forgery.

====Problems with Missing Material====
Hugh Nibley was the first to note that the Book of Mormon contains "colophons." As one review explained:

:A colophon--Greek for "summit, top, finishing"--is a title or header, before or after a text, that may identify an author (such as by name, parentage, origin, education, etc.), the title of text, book, or section…
:<small>— Thomas W. Mackay, "Mormon as Editor: A Study in Colophons, Headers, and Source Indicators," ''Journal of Book of Mormon Studies'' 2:2 (1993): 90-109.</small>

Such colophons can be seen throughout the Book of Mormon—in the English scriptures, they are the italicized portions which precede the chapter heading at the beginning of [http://scriptures.lds.org/1_ne/1 1 Nephi], [http://scriptures.lds.org/2_ne/1 2 Nephi], [http://scriptures.lds.org/jacob/1 Jacob], [http://scriptures.lds.org/alma/1 Alma], [http://scriptures.lds.org/hel/1 Helaman], [http://scriptures.lds.org/3_ne/1 3 Nephi], [http://scriptures.lds.org/4_ne/1 4 Nephi], and [http://scriptures.lds.org/ether/1 Ether]. [http://scriptures.lds.org/mosiah/1 Mosiah] is the only large book without such an introduction. The books of Mormon and Moroni have no colophons, but they are the editors and authors throughout the abridgement, and so have already "given" their colophons initially, as well as identified themselves throughout the text. It's another subtle but authentic touch that no one of Joseph Smith's day knew anything about, or remarked upon until our century.

The lack of a colophon for Mosiah is not surprising, since the first two 'chapters' of Mosiah were part of the lost 116 pages.

Mr. Nemelka betrays himself here by being almost "too clever." He properly includes a colophon at the beginning of his Book of Lehi (imitating, perhaps, 1 Nephi's beginning). But, by the time he has reached the end of his "translation," he has forgotten (if he ever knew) that he needed a Book of Mosiah division with its own colophon.

====Contradictions with the Book of Mormon text====
Mr. Nemelka's offering has thus already been exposed as a forgery, and we haven't even looked at the text itself. He has tripped himself up on merely technical matters—things which are not present betray him. This illustrates the challenge of creating a lengthy, believable forgery.

The Book of Lehi was Mormon's abridged account of the material contained on the small plates, i.e. 1 Nephi - Omni. Therefore, the information in the Book of Lehi should agree with what is on the small plates.

=====Lineage Problems=====
Nemelka makes two fatal errors in genealogy (one within the first chapter), in family lines of unquestioned importance for the Nephite record keepers:

{| border="1" cellpadding="2"
|'''Nemelka – "Book of Lehi" Claim'''||'''Book of Mormon'''
|-
|1. Lehi is descended from Ephraim, son of Joseph (1:11-12)||Lehi is a descendant of Manasseh (Alma 10:3).
|-
|2. "And Mosiah was a direct descendent of Zoram, the servant of Laban who delivered the brass plates unto Nephi and his brethren." (8:25).||Mosiah is a Nephi descendant, and only Nephi descendants are eligible for the kingship. (Mosiah 25:13-14)
|}

Is the reader to believe that the Israelite Nephites, who put so much stock in genealogy and descent, really don't know the difference between two tribes of Israel? Would they really insist one needed to be a descendant of Nephi to rule, when Mosiah—from whom all subsequent kings and rulers derived their legitimacy, including the judges established by his grandson—wasn't even descended from Lehi, much less Nephi?

=====How was the ship built?=====
{| border="1" cellpadding="2"
|'''Nemelka – "Book of Lehi" Claim'''||'''Book of Mormon'''
|-
|1. Nephi built the ship "according to the promptings of the spirit." (6:11)||Lord ''shows'' Nephi in revelation at the mountain how to build the ship. (1 Nephi 18:1-3)
|-
|2. Laman and Lemuel abandon plans to thwart Nephi's shipbuilding because they're so impressed by the ship's "curious" form. (6:12)||Laman and Lemuel won't even help begin the ship's construction, and consider Nephi foolish. (1 Nephi 17:17-18) This prevents the work from progressing at all, and they then taunt Nephi for being unable to do what he proposed. (17:19) They only start helping when they are shocked by the power of the Lord (17:54-55, 18:1)

There is no impressive ship to motivate them until after they begin helping.
|-
|}

====The Problem of Multiple High Priests====

In the "Book of Lehi," Lehi is identified as a High Priest after the order of Aaron. He is not the only contemporaneous High Priest, either, as Nemelka mentions how there were an unspecified number of them present in Jerusalem at the time, in chapter 1, verse 15: "And many of these prophets were bound by the Jews and carried forth unto the High Priests to see what should be done with them." According to Nemelka, these High Priests were called to serve by their lineage and "also by the laying on of hands by those who were in authority." Laban, who was later slain by Nephi, is identified as the chief High Priest.

From the time of Aaron until the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD, there was always only one High Priest, who held that office due only to his status as a Levite and to his descent from Aaron, the first High Priest. Lehi was a Mannasehite, as was Laban, and was thus ineligible. Tellingly, Nemelka's words "...also by the laying on of hands by those who were in authority..." make clear the source for his apparent Quorum of High Priests: his knowledge of modern-day priesthood government. Nemelka's "High Priests" are a clear anachronism.

===Conclusion===
The "Book of Lehi" is a clumsy forgery that fails even a cursory analysis. The author is a self-confessed liar and con man, who also practiced unauthorized plural marriage. Readers should be cautious in trusting such a source.

Many other examples of Nemelka's errors can be downloaded in PDF form [here].

==Further reading==
===FAIR wiki articles===
* [[Forgeries]]

===FAIR web site===
* FAIR Topical Guide:
===External links===
* Ben Fulton, "True Believer," ''Salt Lake City Weekly'' (27 December 2001) ([http://www.slweekly.com/editorial/2001/feat_011227.cfm on-line] copy in author's possession).

===Printed material===

Mark Hofmann

2005-10-18T02:02:04Z

MikeClark: /* FAIR wiki articles */

{{draft}}

==Further reading==

===FAIR wiki articles===
*[[Church_reaction_to_Hofmann_forgeries | Church reaction to Hofmann Forgeries]]
*[[Forgeries]]

===FAIR web site===
*Links to articles on the FAIR web site; Topical Guide entries go first

===External links===
*[http://www.media.utah.edu/UHE/h/HOFMAN,MARK.html Utah History Encyclopedia — Mark Hofmann]

===Printed material===
* Linda Sillitoe and Allen Roberts, ''Salamander: The Story of the Mormon Forgery Murders,'' 2nd. ed. Salt Lake City: Signature Books, 1989. ISBN 0941214877
* Richard E. Turley, ''Victims: The LDS Church and the Mark Hofmann Case'', Urbana and Chicago: University of Illinois Press, 1992. ISBN 0252018850

Forgerers

2005-10-17T14:27:01Z

MikeClark:

{{draft}}

'''Minor problem with article subject / title, here. "Forgerers" is not a word. The correct term is "Forgers" -- have taken the liberty of creating new article, [[Forgers]] and cut/pasted the text of this article into it. Suggest add new material to the new article.
'''

Throughout the history of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, many individuals have forged revelations and historical documents. Their motivations were varied, and included lust for power or money, and a desire to embarrass the Church and its leaders. This article examines some of the more prominent forgerers in Church history, in chronological order.

==The Kinderhook Plates==
''Main article: [[Kinderhook Plates]]''

==James Strang==
''Main article: [[James Strang]]''

==William Saunders Parrot==

In the 19th century, forged metal plates and took them to Salt Lake City. His intent was to prove that Mormonism was a fraud. His daughter, F. Phyllis Parrot, donated the plates to the Bath library in England in 1975. Mr. Parrot also wrote two anti-Mormon pamphlets. Future forger [[Mark Hofmann]] displayed great interest in the plates during his LDS mission to England. [See Linda Sillitoe & Allen Roberts, ''Salamander: The Story of the Mormon Forgery Murders,'' 212.]

==Ben Fuchs==
On 14 January 1976, President Spencer W. Kimball and other Church leaders were told that a London man named Ben Fuchs had informed some LDS missionaries that he had artifacts which belonged to the Church. Investigation showed that Fuchs had some small and large ring-bound brass plates (weighing about 150 lbs), some strange spectacles, and a sword with gems in the hilt.

Fuchs claimed he had received the items from his grandfather, who had gotten them from South America. Fuchs said that he was to give the plates to the church whose missionaries came to his door and said certain words.

Fuchs and his family were baptized, and eventually came to Salt Lake City where they were sealed. Paul Cheesman of BYU retrieved the artifacts, and studied them closely. Anomalies in Fuch's story became evident, and the supposedly ancient 'plates' were determined to be of modern manufacture. The 'gems' in the sword hilt were made of glass.

Fuchs "seemed motivated by material gain" and was excommunicated.

[See Linda Sillitoe & Allen Roberts, ''Salamander: The Story of the Mormon Forgery Murders,'' 213-214.]

==Mark Hofmann==
*''Main article: [[Mark Hofmann]]''
*[[Church reaction to Hofmann forgeries]]

==Christopher Marc Nemelka==
''Main article: [[Christopher Marc Nemelka]]''

Former employee of Church security (and sometime self-professed atheist) Christopher Marc Nemelka has announced that he has been called to translate the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon plates. He has also produced a text purporting to be from the large plates of Nephi, which was lost by Martin Harris as the well-known "Lost 116 pages."

User:MikeClark

2005-09-28T02:25:29Z

MikeClark:

User:MikeClark

2005-09-28T02:25:14Z

MikeClark:

I am Mike Clark (imagine that), and am just playing around for the moment. Here's a mission photograph with my father on the right and me on the left. In the Salt Laked Airport in 1972.

[[Image:MikeClarkMissionPhoto.jpg]]

File:MikeClarkMissionPhoto.jpg

2005-09-28T02:13:22Z

MikeClark:

Question: During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign?

2005-09-17T17:07:13Z

MikeClark:

'''Question: Will there be a secular government during the Millenium, and is there more information about this?'''

''This was a question that came in to the FAIR list, and one answer was sent, from Mike Clark''

----

From : Vardell and Brenda Taylor <br>
Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:37 AM<br>
Subject : During the Millennium

Brothers and Sisters,

I'm hoping someone there can answer a couple questions.

During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign? It seems that I had heard that there will be a 'government headquarters' in a different location to the 'church headquarters'. Do we know where they will be located?

Thanks for any information, or opinions.

Vardell Taylor

----

'''Mike Clark responds...'''

Hi!

I'm a volunteer with FAIR, and do not speak for either FAIR or the church.

The following quote is from "Gospel Principles", which is the class manual used in the Church's Gospel Essentials classes, that is, the class for investigators and new members. It is from chapter 44, entitled "The Millenium," and may be found on page 284 under the heading "Righteous Government":

"Jesus Christ will not only lead the Church during the Millennium, but he will also be in charge of the political government. This government will be based on principles of righteousness and will preserve the basic rights and freedoms of all people. Mortals, both members of the Church and nonmembers, will hold government positions (see Brigham Young, in Journal of Discourses, 2:310). They will receive help from resurrected beings. At this time there will be two capitals in the world, one in Jerusalem, the other in America (see Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3:66-72). "For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isaiah 2:3)."

The book, Gospel Principles, is of course widely available, but an online version, in PDF format, can be found on the Church's official website at:

[http://www.lds.org/gospellibrary/materials/gospel/Start%20Here_01.pdf]

Somewhat more information might be found in "Doctrines of Salvation" by Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr, in volume 3, ppg 69-72.

Hope this helps!

Mike Clark

Question: During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign?

2005-09-17T17:04:41Z

MikeClark:

Question: Will there be a secular government during the Millenium, and is there more information about this?

''This was a question that came in to the FAIR list, and one answer was sent, from Mike Clark''

----

From : Vardell and Brenda Taylor [mailto:vbtaylorfam@hotmail.com] <br>
Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:37 AM<br>
Subject : During the Millennium

Brothers and Sisters,

I'm hoping someone there can answer a couple questions.

During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign? It seems that I had heard that there will be a 'government headquarters' in a different location to the 'church headquarters'. Do we know where they will be located?

Thanks for any information, or opinions.

Vardell Taylor

----

'''Mike Clark responds...'''

Hi!

I'm a volunteer with FAIR, and do not speak for either FAIR or the church.

The following quote is from "Gospel Principles", which is the class manual used in the Church's Gospel Essentials classes, that is, the class for investigators and new members. It is from chapter 44, entitled "The Millenium," and may be found on page 284 under the heading "Righteous Government":

"Jesus Christ will not only lead the Church during the Millennium, but he will also be in charge of the political government. This government will be based on principles of righteousness and will preserve the basic rights and freedoms of all people. Mortals, both members of the Church and nonmembers, will hold government positions (see Brigham Young, in Journal of Discourses, 2:310). They will receive help from resurrected beings. At this time there will be two capitals in the world, one in Jerusalem, the other in America (see Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3:66-72). "For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isaiah 2:3)."

The book, Gospel Principles, is of course widely available, but an online version, in PDF format, can be found on the Church's official website at:

[http://www.lds.org/gospellibrary/materials/gospel/Start%20Here_01.pdf]

Somewhat more information might be found in "Doctrines of Salvation" by Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr, in volume 3, ppg 69-72.

Hope this helps!

Mike Clark
mike@clarkmichael.com

Question: During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign?

2005-09-17T17:01:40Z

MikeClark:

Question: Will there be a secular government during the Millenium, and is there more information about this?

''This was a question that came in to the FAIR list, and one answer was sent, from Mike Clark''

----

*From : Vardell and Brenda Taylor [mailto:vbtaylorfam@hotmail.com]
*Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:37 AM
*Subject : During the Millennium

Brothers and Sisters,

I'm hoping someone there can answer a couple questions.

During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign? It seems that I had heard that there will be a 'government headquarters' in a different location to the 'church headquarters'. Do we know where they will be located?

Thanks for any information, or opinions.

Vardell Taylor

----

'''Mike Clark responds...'''

Hi!

I'm a volunteer with FAIR, and do not speak for either FAIR or the church.

The following quote is from "Gospel Principles", which is the class manual used in the Church's Gospel Essentials classes, that is, the class for investigators and new members. It is from chapter 44, entitled "The Millenium," and may be found on page 284 under the heading "Righteous Government":

"Jesus Christ will not only lead the Church during the Millennium, but he will also be in charge of the political government. This government will be based on principles of righteousness and will preserve the basic rights and freedoms of all people. Mortals, both members of the Church and nonmembers, will hold government positions (see Brigham Young, in Journal of Discourses, 2:310). They will receive help from resurrected beings. At this time there will be two capitals in the world, one in Jerusalem, the other in America (see Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3:66-72). "For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isaiah 2:3)."

The book, Gospel Principles, is of course widely available, but an online version, in PDF format, can be found on the Church's official website at:

[http://www.lds.org/gospellibrary/materials/gospel/Start%20Here_01.pdf]

Somewhat more information might be found in "Doctrines of Salvation" by Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr, in volume 3, ppg 69-72.

Hope this helps!

Mike Clark
mike@clarkmichael.com

Question: During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign?

2005-09-17T17:00:49Z

MikeClark:

Question: Will there be a secular government during the Millenium, and is there more information about this?

''This was a question that came in to the FAIR list, and one answer was sent, from Mike Clark''

----

From : Vardell and Brenda Taylor [mailto:vbtaylorfam@hotmail.com]
Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:37 AM
Subject : During the Millennium

Brothers and Sisters,

I'm hoping someone there can answer a couple questions.

During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign? It seems that I had heard that there will be a 'government headquarters' in a different location to the 'church headquarters'. Do we know where they will be located?

Thanks for any information, or opinions.

Vardell Taylor

----

== '''Mike Clark responds...''' ==

Hi!

I'm a volunteer with FAIR, and do not speak for either FAIR or the church.

The following quote is from "Gospel Principles", which is the class manual used in the Church's Gospel Essentials classes, that is, the class for investigators and new members. It is from chapter 44, entitled "The Millenium," and may be found on page 284 under the heading "Righteous Government":

"Jesus Christ will not only lead the Church during the Millennium, but he will also be in charge of the political government. This government will be based on principles of righteousness and will preserve the basic rights and freedoms of all people. Mortals, both members of the Church and nonmembers, will hold government positions (see Brigham Young, in Journal of Discourses, 2:310). They will receive help from resurrected beings. At this time there will be two capitals in the world, one in Jerusalem, the other in America (see Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3:66-72). "For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isaiah 2:3)."

The book, Gospel Principles, is of course widely available, but an online version, in PDF format, can be found on the Church's official website at:

http://www.lds.org/gospellibrary/materials/gospel/Start%20Here_01.pdf

Somewhat more information might be found in "Doctrines of Salvation" by Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr, in volume 3, ppg 69-72.

Hope this helps!

Mike Clark
mike@clarkmichael.com

Question: During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign?

2005-09-17T17:00:24Z

MikeClark:

Question: Will there be a secular government during the Millenium, and is there more information about this?

''This was a question that came in to the FAIR list, and one answer was sent, from Mike Clark''

----

From : Vardell and Brenda Taylor [mailto:vbtaylorfam@hotmail.com]
Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:37 AM
Subject : During the Millennium

Brothers and Sisters,

I'm hoping someone there can answer a couple questions.

During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign? It seems that I had heard that there will be a 'government headquarters' in a different location to the 'church headquarters'. Do we know where they will be located?

Thanks for any information, or opinions.

Vardell Taylor

----
'''Mike Clark responds...'''

Hi!

I'm a volunteer with FAIR, and do not speak for either FAIR or the church.

The following quote is from "Gospel Principles", which is the class manual used in the Church's Gospel Essentials classes, that is, the class for investigators and new members. It is from chapter 44, entitled "The Millenium," and may be found on page 284 under the heading "Righteous Government":

"Jesus Christ will not only lead the Church during the Millennium, but he will also be in charge of the political government. This government will be based on principles of righteousness and will preserve the basic rights and freedoms of all people. Mortals, both members of the Church and nonmembers, will hold government positions (see Brigham Young, in Journal of Discourses, 2:310). They will receive help from resurrected beings. At this time there will be two capitals in the world, one in Jerusalem, the other in America (see Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3:66-72). "For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isaiah 2:3)."

The book, Gospel Principles, is of course widely available, but an online version, in PDF format, can be found on the Church's official website at:

http://www.lds.org/gospellibrary/materials/gospel/Start%20Here_01.pdf

Somewhat more information might be found in "Doctrines of Salvation" by Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr, in volume 3, ppg 69-72.

Hope this helps!

Mike Clark
mike@clarkmichael.com

Question: During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign?

2005-09-17T17:00:01Z

MikeClark:

Question: Will there be a secular government during the Millenium, and is there more information about this?

''This was a question that came in to the FAIR list, and one answer was sent, from Mike Clark''

----

From : Vardell and Brenda Taylor [mailto:vbtaylorfam@hotmail.com] -
Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:37 AM
Subject : During the Millennium

Brothers and Sisters,

I'm hoping someone there can answer a couple questions.

During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign? It seems that I had heard that there will be a 'government headquarters' in a different location to the 'church headquarters'. Do we know where they will be located?

Thanks for any information, or opinions.

Vardell Taylor

----
'''Mike Clark responds...'''

Hi!

I'm a volunteer with FAIR, and do not speak for either FAIR or the church.

The following quote is from "Gospel Principles", which is the class manual used in the Church's Gospel Essentials classes, that is, the class for investigators and new members. It is from chapter 44, entitled "The Millenium," and may be found on page 284 under the heading "Righteous Government":

"Jesus Christ will not only lead the Church during the Millennium, but he will also be in charge of the political government. This government will be based on principles of righteousness and will preserve the basic rights and freedoms of all people. Mortals, both members of the Church and nonmembers, will hold government positions (see Brigham Young, in Journal of Discourses, 2:310). They will receive help from resurrected beings. At this time there will be two capitals in the world, one in Jerusalem, the other in America (see Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3:66-72). "For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isaiah 2:3)."

The book, Gospel Principles, is of course widely available, but an online version, in PDF format, can be found on the Church's official website at:

http://www.lds.org/gospellibrary/materials/gospel/Start%20Here_01.pdf

Somewhat more information might be found in "Doctrines of Salvation" by Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr, in volume 3, ppg 69-72.

Hope this helps!

Mike Clark
mike@clarkmichael.com

Question: During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign?

2005-09-17T16:59:43Z

MikeClark:

Question: Will there be a secular government during the Millenium, and is there more information about this?

''This was a question that came in to the FAIR list, and one answer was sent, from Mike Clark''

----

From : Vardell and Brenda Taylor [mailto:vbtaylorfam@hotmail.com] - Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:37 AM
Subject : During the Millennium

Brothers and Sisters,

I'm hoping someone there can answer a couple questions.

During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign? It seems that I had heard that there will be a 'government headquarters' in a different location to the 'church headquarters'. Do we know where they will be located?

Thanks for any information, or opinions.

Vardell Taylor

----
'''Mike Clark responds...'''

Hi!

I'm a volunteer with FAIR, and do not speak for either FAIR or the church.

The following quote is from "Gospel Principles", which is the class manual used in the Church's Gospel Essentials classes, that is, the class for investigators and new members. It is from chapter 44, entitled "The Millenium," and may be found on page 284 under the heading "Righteous Government":

"Jesus Christ will not only lead the Church during the Millennium, but he will also be in charge of the political government. This government will be based on principles of righteousness and will preserve the basic rights and freedoms of all people. Mortals, both members of the Church and nonmembers, will hold government positions (see Brigham Young, in Journal of Discourses, 2:310). They will receive help from resurrected beings. At this time there will be two capitals in the world, one in Jerusalem, the other in America (see Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3:66-72). "For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isaiah 2:3)."

The book, Gospel Principles, is of course widely available, but an online version, in PDF format, can be found on the Church's official website at:

http://www.lds.org/gospellibrary/materials/gospel/Start%20Here_01.pdf

Somewhat more information might be found in "Doctrines of Salvation" by Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr, in volume 3, ppg 69-72.

Hope this helps!

Mike Clark
mike@clarkmichael.com

Question: During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign?

2005-09-17T16:59:27Z

MikeClark:

Question: Will there be a secular government during the Millenium, and is there more information about this?

''This was a question that came in to the FAIR list, and one answer was sent, from Mike Clark''

From : Vardell and Brenda Taylor [mailto:vbtaylorfam@hotmail.com] - Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:37 AM
Subject : During the Millennium

Brothers and Sisters,

I'm hoping someone there can answer a couple questions.

During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign? It seems that I had heard that there will be a 'government headquarters' in a different location to the 'church headquarters'. Do we know where they will be located?

Thanks for any information, or opinions.

Vardell Taylor

----
'''Mike Clark responds...'''

Hi!

I'm a volunteer with FAIR, and do not speak for either FAIR or the church.

The following quote is from "Gospel Principles", which is the class manual used in the Church's Gospel Essentials classes, that is, the class for investigators and new members. It is from chapter 44, entitled "The Millenium," and may be found on page 284 under the heading "Righteous Government":

"Jesus Christ will not only lead the Church during the Millennium, but he will also be in charge of the political government. This government will be based on principles of righteousness and will preserve the basic rights and freedoms of all people. Mortals, both members of the Church and nonmembers, will hold government positions (see Brigham Young, in Journal of Discourses, 2:310). They will receive help from resurrected beings. At this time there will be two capitals in the world, one in Jerusalem, the other in America (see Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3:66-72). "For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isaiah 2:3)."

The book, Gospel Principles, is of course widely available, but an online version, in PDF format, can be found on the Church's official website at:

http://www.lds.org/gospellibrary/materials/gospel/Start%20Here_01.pdf

Somewhat more information might be found in "Doctrines of Salvation" by Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr, in volume 3, ppg 69-72.

Hope this helps!

Mike Clark
mike@clarkmichael.com

Question: During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign?

2005-09-17T16:58:04Z

MikeClark:

Question: Will there be a secular government during the Millenium, and is there more information about this?

From : Vardell and Brenda Taylor [mailto:vbtaylorfam@hotmail.com] - Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 11:37 AM
Subject : During the Millennium

Brothers and Sisters,

I'm hoping someone there can answer a couple questions.

During the millennium, will there be a secular government in addition to Christ's reign?

It seems that I had heard that there will be a 'government headquarters' in a different location to the 'church headquarters'. Do we know where they will be located?

Thanks for any information, or opinions.

Vardell Taylor

----
!!Mike Clark responds...

Hi!

I'm a volunteer with FAIR, and do not speak for either FAIR or the church.

The following quote is from "Gospel Principles", which is the class manual used in the Church's Gospel Essentials classes, that is, the class for investigators and new members. It is from chapter 44, entitled "The Millenium," and may be found on page 284 under the heading "Righteous Government":

"Jesus Christ will not only lead the Church during the Millennium, but he will also be in charge of the political government. This government will be based on principles of righteousness and will preserve the basic rights and freedoms of all people. Mortals, both members of the Church and nonmembers, will hold government positions (see Brigham Young, in Journal of Discourses, 2:310). They will receive help from resurrected beings. At this time there will be two capitals in the world, one in Jerusalem, the other in America (see Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3:66-72). "For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem" (Isaiah 2:3)."

The book, Gospel Principles, is of course widely available, but an online version, in PDF format, can be found on the Church's official website at:

http://www.lds.org/gospellibrary/materials/gospel/Start%20Here_01.pdf

Somewhat more information might be found in "Doctrines of Salvation" by Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr, in volume 3, ppg 69-72.

Hope this helps!

Mike Clark
mike@clarkmichael.com

User:MikeClark

2005-09-17T16:52:50Z

MikeClark:

I am Mike Clark (imagine that), and am just playing around for the moment. So far, so good, but cannot upload pictures.